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Hi Everyone

I think most of the major changes are done, I think. Now I will be just doing small stuff to improve security and hopefully make everything look better. :)

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-D1-

Chocolate flavoured galaxy

1235716

Comments

  • edited 2:54PM
    To me every spaceship since elite is a "ship" :D
  • s2odans2odan Pioneer Developer & Moderator
    edited 2:54PM
    There will only be one of these, who's gonna find it first?

    Textures on known planets. Programs like Orbiter use dx7. Pleistocenic rendering, but the view of the earth and planets are amazing. Will be something like this in future? Are addon textures possible into the procedural generator?




    Pioneer accepts heightmaps which when combined with a decent colour for the terrain would be nearly as good as high resolution textures. The only one is for earth, but the heightmap is not a large one and the colours for earth would need a bit of tweaking.

    I have some heightmaps that can be used in Pioneer for earth, moon and mars but have no way of converting them to pioneer's format.

    I also wanted to make some heightmaps for some other custom worlds other than in sol but have held off on that until I know how to get them in the game.
  • edited 2:54PM
    s20dan wrote:
    There will only be one of these, who's gonna find it first


    ... is not likely to return :mrgreen:

    since any movement in this system knows just one direction, i guess immediate departure via hyperspace is the key to survice, right? :lol:
  • edited 2:54PM
    black hole survival
  • s2odans2odan Pioneer Developer & Moderator
    edited 2:54PM
    Yes flying there would probably mean certain death :)

    I have flown around the smaller version of the blackholes the Intermediate-mass black holes and its just about possible, but really we would need a pro-grade and retro-grade option on the autopilot so you can point in the correct direction and use time acceleration to increase or decrease your orbit.
  • edited 2:54PM
    Regarding water, i think that's doable. It could be tied in with the atmosphere of the planet. Below a certain level the atmosphere becomes much more viscous. Think about a gas giant. The lower you go, the thicker and mushier the atmosphere becomes. On a water world there would be a sea level boundary beneath which you would enter a buoyant fluid environment. The sea floor would be determined by the planet's topography. A Moray Starboat could take you to underwater bases!
  • s2odans2odan Pioneer Developer & Moderator
    edited 2:54PM
    Water would really finish of the views from space of some of the planets, they would look breathtaking.



    Here's an example how the interface changes look in-game and of being pulled into a super-massive black hole:



    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wPn3U5OOSKk&hd=1
  • edited 2:54PM
    Well s20dan, I finally got to play a bit with alpha 7.5-wip, so here's some thoughts.



    First, the powers of two textures from alpha 7.0's 4 Eagles and Lanner are lost. I copied them over, but it's a concern for at least two old computers around here.



    Second, the atmospheric shielding needs work. I bought a Viper at Shanghai, (The price was certainly right, I had enough money left over to kit it out well. :lol: ) Anyway, when I lifted off I thought I was experiencing a bug due to that red sphere surrounding me. As I climbed and it faded I got the idea. I never thought that the atmospheric shield would be visible. I'm ok with the idea, but you seem to have the red color tied to the atmospheric density and I think it should be linked to the hull temperature. It would be invisible when there is no friction, and slowly appear as a soap bubble around the craft as it gained speed. It would turn only red and opaque when nearing overload.



    Third, alpha 7 save games work, but, Pioneer CTDs when I save and try to load the saved game. No big deal. I'm happy with my Viper. Reg# ED-8336. I named it Ed. :twisted:



    I installed my latest spacestations.lua, and it works. I just did a fly-by of Io, (nice!) and now I'm heading to Jupiter to test out my new fuel scoop!
  • s2odans2odan Pioneer Developer & Moderator
    edited 2:54PM
    First, the powers of two textures from alpha 7.0's 4 Eagles and Lanner are lost. I copied them over, but it's a concern for at least two old computers around here.


    Uncle Bob mentioned that and posted the link so they shoud be in next time.


    Second, the atmospheric shielding needs work. I bought a Viper at Shanghai, (The price was certainly right, I had enough money left over to kit it out well. :lol: ) Anyway, when I lifted off I thought I was experiencing a bug due to that red sphere surrounding me. As I climbed and it faded I got the idea. I never thought that the atmospheric shield would be visible. I'm ok with the idea, but you seem to have the red color tied to the atmospheric density and I think it should be linked to the hull temperature. It would be invisible when there is no friction, and slowly appear as a soap bubble around the craft as it gained speed. It would turn only red and opaque when nearing overload.




    Hmm that sounds to me like you bought yourself a regular shield and didnt know that they have a graphic :) Always have as far as I know. I find it distracting so I always use time accel when I get one so it charges, the graphic goes when its charged.

    If you go and shoot some baddies and you should see their shield change colour as you blast them.
  • edited 2:54PM
    There will only be one of these, who's gonna find it first?




    If it's where it's supposed to be, it should be pretty simple to find... but a looooong way from home. :?
  • edited 2:54PM
    Hmm that sounds to me like you bought yourself a regular shield and didnt know that they have a graphic :)


    Oh, thanks. Now it makes sense. :oops:
  • s2odans2odan Pioneer Developer & Moderator
    edited 2:54PM
    UncleBob wrote:


    If it's where it's supposed to be, it should be pretty simple to find... but a looooong way from home. :?




    Of course... but where is earth in relation to that...? If you look in the code you will see its a doddle to find it, but *they* don't know that ;).. The player will know from the galactic overview map that Earth is right of center, but how much is it to the right of center? And is it north or south of center? ... ect ect....

    While I know these answers and you probably do to, the average player won't know the precise location, only that its 'that-a way' :). Anyway thats what I was aiming at and the fact that even if you do know where it is, you wont ever see it without cheating.



    Rest assured that I haven't hidden the blackhole away somewhere... it will be in the only place it can realistically exist. ;)



    As for Stellar Blackholes, they are a different matter, they should populate the galaxy like stars however they are of course rarer than any star. So would be very difficult to find.
  • edited 2:54PM


    As for Stellar Blackholes, they are a different matter, they should populate the galaxy like stars however they are of course rarer than any star. So would be very difficult to find.




    at least according to current stellar evolution theories, "common" black holes should be a lot more frequent than high-mass stars (60 solar masses upwards, the really big boys), because all of them should leave a black hole behind at the end of their lifecycle, which at those masses is barely a few million years long. And since there undoubtedly have been more around of them since the beginning of the milkyway than are around currently, that should result in a pretty "high" black hole density (since there's maybe about 6.7e-5 percent of stars that massive, it still shouldn't be more than a few hundred thousand, though).
  • s2odans2odan Pioneer Developer & Moderator
    edited 2:54PM
    Here's what I added into the game, if you know a more correct naming system and/or statistics I would welcome that:



    Stellar Black holes 0.2 Solar Masses to 20.0 SM. Radius is around 10 - 40KM

    Intermediate mass Blackholes 1,000SM - 20,000SM. Radius around the size of earth.

    Supermassive Black Hole 100,000,000SM - 20,000,000,000,000 (although this isn't used as there is only one super massive black hole and it will most porbably be added manually by hand.)



    Although the only ones so far that are actually in galaxy generation are the small stellar black holes, as I'm unsure about the Intermediate mass ones.
  • edited 2:54PM
    The only thing I can say without further research is that barely any star will leave behind 20 solar masses to form a black hole. Black holes formed by supernovae are expected to be significantly below 10 solar masses, as far as I know, since most of the star material goes off flying through the galaxy...
  • s2odans2odan Pioneer Developer & Moderator
    edited 2:54PM
    Thats what I have read too, and this mainly applies to the 'Stellar Blackoles'

    However the Intermediate-mass Blackholes are in fact billions of years old, and probably started out as a regular blackhole, but then they got hungry ;) They are the class in between a supermassive blackhole and a regular collapsed star blackhole.

    So a blackhole like that would have been gorging itself on the galaxy's stars for many billions of years, ever growing.



    However I'm unsure if we would even have one of those types in our galaxy.
  • edited 2:54PM
    Isn't there a theory that super massive black holes exist at the heart of most, if not all, galaxies and may in fact be essential to their creation?
  • s2odans2odan Pioneer Developer & Moderator
    edited 2:54PM
    That is what is currently believed yes but it is un-proven that every galaxy has one, although we can see evidence of them in many galaxies. We also have no direct proof that there is a supermassive blackhole in our galaxy, however we do know that right at the center there is an extremely massive amount of mass (millions of solar masses) within around .2 LY or something, although those figures might be incorrect they are from memory.

    So that would seem to indicate that there is one in our galaxy.



    Thought I would check those values just in case, here we go:
    ......

    * From the motion of star S2, we estimate the object's mass as 4.1 million solar masses.[10]

    * We also know that the radius of the central object is significantly less than 17 light hours, because otherwise, S2 would either collide with it or be ripped apart by tidal forces. In fact, recent observations[11] indicate that the radius is no more than 6.25 light-hours, about the diameter of Uranus' orbit.

    * The only known object which can pack 4.1 million solar masses into a volume that small is a black hole.




    Anyway, I find them fascinating :) Mathematically they allow all kinds of crazy things to happen, however the reality is probably that our maths is not up to scratch, and that they are really just big black balls of death and the end of all things. Or perhaps when the universe is finally eaten by the MOTHER of all black holes, then it will just start again in another big bang.
  • edited 2:54PM
    I am not an expert but could consider logical the gravitational movement, union and spiral form of some galaxies due to a massive Black Hole. Perhaps the Galaxies are Galaxies due to the Black Holes.



    It is said that when a Galaxy eats another, the black holes, a lot of them, go center, wins the strongest and grow.



    Some months ago scientifics discovered huge potential Gamma Ray fonts (ten throusand millions of volts) from the galactic center, in form of two massive bubbles.



    The massive hungry companion of Milky way? :)



    1baa6dfff88a8de5adb323c6ced54180.jpg



    Two bubbles of 50.000 light years of height :mrgreen: I am very tiny...
  • larswillenlarswillen SSC Supporter
    edited 2:54PM
    i have try to use the fuel scoop-but i failed



    how to use the fuel scoop?
  • edited 2:54PM
    in theory the fuel scoop u go thro a gas giant atmosphere and maybe its not in the game yet but u would activate it at a certain range from the planet and scoop up atmospheric gases ( hydrogen for the most part)
  • edited 2:54PM
    I successfully used a fuel scoop at Jupiter using a Viper in alpha 7.5. Assuming you bought one and atmospheric shielding and have cargo space available, ;) , skim the upper atmosphere at a pressure near 1.0 at 40kps or less. Watch your hull temperature and be careful about overheating.
  • edited 2:54PM
    will be different based on size of atmosphere , planet/ gas giant etc.



    Down the track how about robotic mining ships u can deploy that u can tag in space jump off somewhere else and come back to and collect materials



    Could be useful for pirates or those maintaining their own player colony far out and needing mid point fuelling points to ge tmateirals in and out
  • edited 2:54PM
    Thought I's share this comment I found in this link from the mini-chat.

    http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2011/01 ... cancelled/


    If anything ‘Elite’ is more profitable as a legacy identity. Take the star system from the original and strap it onto a mass effect style game (IE ground exploration & some 3rd person shooting, brawling and sexing Kirk style), throw in a few detailed locations & NPCs, and a heap tonne of procedurally generated ones, with maybe the odd galactic war/uprising or two (and hidden super secret here and there), and a bunch of patron missions. Also ensure everything is covered in awesom-o-vision gel. Do that and maybe (just maybe), you might sell the 3-4 million units necessary to justify heavy investment. No small order tbh.




    That sounds like Pioneer 2.0! :lol:
  • edited 2:54PM
    sounds like yes what pioneer can acehieve long term the progress to date just about exceeds elite 3
  • s2odans2odan Pioneer Developer & Moderator
    edited 2:54PM
    Here's an early attempt at a better Earth:

  • edited 2:54PM
    s2odan wrote:
    Here's an early attempt at a better Earth:



    Its basically just a new colour scheme for the terran world terrains that is more sensitive to height.




    Looks pretty well S2odan! very good looking!
  • tommtomm Pioneer Developer
    edited 2:54PM
    s2odan wrote:
    Here's an early attempt at a better Earth:



    Its basically just a new colour scheme for the terran world terrains that is more sensitive to height.




    That looks nice. Another problem with earth is it uses a limited resolution earth heightmap (and the next resolution up that I had was 25mb and I couldn't justify that - nor would it provide enough resolution). I couldn't find a fractal to modify the heightmap with that would retain the essential terrain details (ie keep the highlands of scotland rugged and norfolk flat).



    Perhaps feeding the heightmap point's normal to the fractal as a roughness value would be some use.
  • s2odans2odan Pioneer Developer & Moderator
    edited 2:54PM
    Thanks, I actually have some half-decent height-maps that can be manipulated by photoshop into various sizes, but I had trouble converting them into the required format.

    If its of any use I can send them to you.

    Edit// Ah, nevermind If I understand your post correctly they would be of no use anyway.



    Edit2..

    This might work, if you can find a way to apply terrain settings to a planet after it has the heightmap loaded, then we could fake a nice looking earth using the fractal mountains and such tied directly into teh height of the map, I'm sure it could work, using a similar idea that I used to make the new colur scheme.
  • tommtomm Pioneer Developer
    edited 2:54PM
    s2odan wrote:


    This might work, if you can find a way to apply terrain settings to a planet after it has the heightmap loaded, then we could fake a nice looking earth using the fractal mountains and such tied directly into teh height of the map, I'm sure it could work, using a similar idea that I used to make the new colur scheme.




    See the last line of the function double GeoSphereStyle::GetHeightMapVal(const vector3d &pt):



    return (v<0 ? 0 : v + 100*octavenoise(10, 0.5, 2.0, 1000.0*pt));



    This applies a sortof crap rolling hills perlin thing to the filtered height map value. You can replace this with a height map fractal of your choice. The trick is making it in keeping with the height map itself while adding useful detail (or masking the lack of detail...)
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