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  • #69277
    AvatarPotsmoke66
    Participant

    a fake landing

    [attachment=588:2011-03-05_184344.jpg]




    Humble Book Bundle ends on 9/11/2019


    #69278
    Avatarollobrain
    Participant

    define a fake look

    #69279
    MarcelMarcel
    Participant

    This is a revival of an old thread, but I have a question about modeling. I’ve been detailing the mushroom_station. I made a smoked glass material for the tapered cylinder on top of the control tower and a simple interior, made to be seen from a distance. I’ve learned a bit about the hierarchy of the file regarding transparency, and moved the tapered cylinder to the end of the static part of the model so that the landing pads display through the glass.

    [attachment=924:glass01.jpg]

    Notice, however that the local city buildings don’t display through the glass…

    [attachment=925:glass02.jpg]

    but the distant city buildings do.

    [attachment=926:glass03.jpg]

    My ship is on the other side of the glass and doesn’t display either. Anyone have thoughts on how to fix this, or should I just leave it as it is for now?

    #69280
    MarcelMarcel
    Participant

    Here’s an overview of the thing. I still have to add the lamps and lenses around the pads, not to mention merging this and the other stuff I’ve done into alpha 15 with the mip-mapping and lights and such.

    [attachment=927:glass04.jpg]

    Thought I’d post one more. I think the ‘inside’ material I used on the outside doesn’t fit well with Vlastan’s buildings, but soon they won’t be seen together anyway. I’m going for an other-worldly type glow here.

    [attachment=928:glass05.jpg]

    Ok, make that two more. I was looking at what I’d done and thinking about how It’s all typed into a text editor and then appears like magic! This is incredibly fun! 😀

    [attachment=929:glass06.jpg]

    #69281
    Avatarrobn
    Participant

    Its to do with the way draw depth is managed. See issue #24. While I do have a little more intuition on the problem than I did when I first opened that issue I still don’t fully understand it. I’m not sure anyone currently active does. I don’t have a good answer for you right now, but I hope that we’ll get it sorted sooner rather than later.

    #69282
    MarcelMarcel
    Participant

    Thanks for the reply. Z bias? Or do we need to re-arrange the folders and make a transparent bit a separate model called below every other model? I think that, while it breaks immersion a little bit, I’ll ignore it for now and go play with something else. 🙂

    #69283
    Avatars2odan
    Participant

    That station is looking good Marcel. I like the detail inside the tower 🙂

    #69284
    MarcelMarcel
    Participant

    Thanks! 😀 I’ll have a test version of this of this uploaded eventually. It won’t make it into alpha 15, however.[attachment=930:glass07.jpg]

    #69285
    AvatarPotsmoke66
    Participant

    i hope this is not complete nonesense.

    we have in pioneer so called “alpha glow” (it’s named that) as transperency.

    alpha glow or alpha channel transparency has a disadvantage, the hierarchy, or the problem that everything vanishes behind a previously rendered alpha channel. it’s a nice way to make complicated shapes without the possibility of a *boolean operation on the mesh for scripted models (i wish i could upload the models i made meanwhile).

    if i’m not wrong, there existsts a z-transparency.

    i remember this from NFS and proper windows for the cars, which need no alpha glow but a set z-transparency to give proper windows which show all parts of the scene regardless of their render time, even when you have two windows or more overlaying each other.

    *this yes/no stuff means for meshes you can unite two meshes in different ways, each could separate or be united with the other. in simple words, used to make the many excavations or exaltations you see sometimes on shipmodels.

    btw, i’m not shure which i should prefere, some would say a created surface with a boolean is better or more realistic, i don’t know, at least you have far more possibilities. but they allways leave some “evil” creases on the surface and sometimes i really prefere the cutting with a previously rendered “hole” and a inverted box in front (or similar), it leaves no marks on the surface.

    a mix of both techniques is sometimes best, as if you like to have a hole in a sphere shaped body, make the i.e. cylinder behind with such a boolean operation, use the circular shape that results from the operation as cutting holes, but leave the sphere untouched. now you have a perfect fitting cylinder but the sphere shows no creases and has still a perfect shape.

    #69286
    Avatarfluffyfreak
    Participant

    It’s a problem with alpha testing geometry you have to render it back to front (z-order) so that it looks correct. The best thing to do is not have overlapping or back-to-back transparent objects. Is it something that you can avoid?

    PS: sorry not my best explanation – I mean, can you avoid the situation that you have with car windows? So, avoid being able to see through one window and out of another?

    #69287
    AvatarPotsmoke66
    Participant

    well it can be avoided, but limits the possibilities, or i have to accept the limited result (which i do usually).

    or to say in other words, one of my last creations is a two seated fighter, where the pilots sit shoulder to shoulder but each in a separate cockpit, is a pure disregard of this limits.

    also th domes and any such in the city leaves this as problem, or you have to remove all such glassy things that could cover something. that’s evil imo, how to make a nice space port (city) without? only bunkers? no biodomes? skyscrapers are nice to see on (any) earth but on a moon?

    apart from that there is a second problem (if it’s not solved allready), with rendering time of the starport and the city.

    any transparent parts, even the lights cut out the latter rendered city bodies, but i guess that’s deniable.

    see, can be avoided but only with loss (to much imo).

    #69288
    Avatarfluffyfreak
    Participant

    Hmm, no those cases should all be possible. I was thinking of the single object with multiple overdrawn layers of transparency.

    I guess it depends how we’re doing transparency. Testing and blending have different issues.

    #69289
    Avatarrobn
    Participant

    Its a known bug/issue. We currently draw the entire city as a single object – its component don’t get depth sorted, only the city as a whole. It wouldn’t be a huge undertaking to fix though it would require a bit of restructuring.

    #69290
    AvatarPotsmoke66
    Participant

    one rather simple solution, we leave the domes away and mark only with some struts where they should be and live with the fact that every john and henry will ask “why can i fly through this biodomes?” 😀

    #69291
    AvatarTonySpike
    Participant

    i havent tested the alpha 15 release yet (work in progress) ..but i was wondering if anyone managed to fix the collision detection on the panther clipper and viper defence craft …..it seems they dont touch down on landing pads properly ……..im assuming its a problem for the modelers to deal with …….if not i will repost this somewhere else lol ..sorry if it isnt

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