Home Forums Space/SciFi Combat and Simulation Game Discussion Why is Space Sim Gaming so unpopular?

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  • #57675
    AvatarShodex
    Participant

    There’s no denying Space Sims are fun, action packed, strategical, rewarding, beautiful games. Some of them can’t really be considered games, some of them are simulations in the strictest sense, some are works of art, some are stress relievers, some of them are life suckers.

    How can something so amazing be so unknown outside the indie gaming crowd? It wasn’t always like this, but lately big releases of Space Sims have been completely non existent. Is this because of PC gaming’s dying numbers, are Space Sim games just too much for the little consoles and their little buttons to handle?

    The only releases that seem to come out are from smaller developers, although, thats in a way a good thing. Since the “mainstream” has a habit of messing everything up.

    Well, before I start ranting on an interstellar scale, what are you’re opinions about the downfall of Space Sims?




    A bunch of classics here on the cheap if you get them all in one bundle

    #70301
    PinbackPinback
    Keymaster

    I got three words for you “The games industry”, the only thing they are interested in is profit and franchises. It the only thing they ever talk about now days, plus the fact that the genre has not advanced much in the last 20 years. We still have the same two basic type of game ie Elite and Wing Commander, just being made over and over again with new graphics. This is what IMO killed it off in the first place, too many “just another space sim” set in space.

    #70302
    AvatarShodex
    Participant

    It’s not like FPS has gone through radical transformations, yet it still leads the industry.

    #70303
    sscadminsscadmin
    Keymaster

    Think we need a WOW factor again in space games. Like back in the 90’s when WC3 and WC4 came out that was an amazing accomplishment for games in general to integrate so well FMV into a game and have it really tie into a great story. I mean c’mon Christopher Blair kicked ass and he did so because of your flying and your decisions in the game. And the supporting cast of actors and budget. Yes, for its time the Wing Commander games were top notch and they spawned a lot of other space games around the success.

    What makes a great game for me is story… plain and simple. I want to care about my character and what happens to them. I want my flying and desicion making to have an effect of the environment while I play. I’m going to use my wife as an example (hope she doesn’t read this), but she watching me play some games lets say Ascii Sector. First response…. what are you playing? I explain the game and what you can do and she looks at me like whatever makes you happy 🙂 Load up something like X3TC and she looks at it and says WOW that game looks nice, until I explain the game and how to play it and then no interest happens… way to complicated for me to play that. But one night I was watching the compilation of the WC3 and WC4 videos (all one continuious movie) and she was like what are you watching because she was next to me listening to the story. And she commented on all the actors and how it wasn’t cheesy. And when I told her it was all compiled video from one game she was amazed 😯

    She was actually interested in the story it was telling. Today’s games really lack the story element in games. Yes FPS games rule the roost currently but they have no depth and you burn out on it quickly. MW2 was the biggest game in 2009 on the console. But do you know if your a decent player and play on normal mode you can beat the entire campaign in 6hrs….? I know people want multiplayer in everything today, but a rich single player experience for me is where its at.

    Oh starting to ramble now… so i’ll stop.

    #70304
    PinbackPinback
    Keymaster
    Shodex wrote:
    It’s not like FPS has gone through radical transformations, yet it still leads the industry.

    I would say that FPS game have gone through a lot of changes from the early games,they also have one huge advantage over a space sim game in that they can be set in any environmrnt the deves can think of.Unlike space sim which are stuck with one ie space,big dark and for the most part empty.Some the games do have the odd planet excursion mission but for the most part you still stuck in the cockpit.

    #70305
    AvatarEmpyrean
    Participant
    PINBACK wrote:
    Shodex wrote:
    It’s not like FPS has gone through radical transformations, yet it still leads the industry.

    I would say that FPS game have gone through a lot of changes from the early games,they also have one huge advantage over a space sim game in that they can be set in any environmrnt the deves can think of.

    I’d have to disagree. The general story and gameplay of an FPS is the following:

    “[Insert evil country/person/corporation/aliens/hell] is trying to take over [the World/technology/Candyland] and you, the [genetically enhanced soldier/lucky guy/Rambo/the player] must defeat it because [the army/police/Jesus] couldn’t. Pheww, phewww, ratatatata (machine gun sound 🙂 ), the day is [saved/cliffhanger/destroyed].” Ofcourse you can always mix some elements of other genres like RPG (S.T.A.L.K.E.R.), tactics (Ghost Recon) etc, but then it’s not a pure FPS; not to mention that you could do the same things with spacegames.

    I’ll give credit for the various environment though.

    IMO the biggest problem is with the gamers themselves, who like games like Gears of War with their “epic one-button gameplay” (this was written on the Hungarian Gears of War). Puzzles like in Half Life 2 are like physics-tests for them, so they won’t try anything more complicated the “WASD and click”.

    #70306
    PinbackPinback
    Keymaster
    Empyrean wrote:

    I’d have to disagree. The general story and gameplay of an FPS is the following:

    “[Insert evil country/person/corporation/aliens/hell] is trying to take over [the World/technology/Candyland] and you, the [genetically enhanced soldier/lucky guy/Rambo/the player] must defeat it because [the army/police/Jesus] couldn’t. Pheww, phewww, ratatatata (machine gun sound 🙂 ), the day is [saved/cliffhanger/destroyed].” Ofcourse you can always mix some elements of other genres like RPG (S.T.A.L.K.E.R.), tactics (Ghost Recon) etc, but then it’s not a pure FPS; not to mention that you could do the same things with spacegames.

    [/quote]

    I agree that the basic idea behind the FPS has not changed, but where FPS have evolved is in adding

    other elements to the gameplay over the last 20 years like physics, storylines the epic set peace even branching storylines.

    I think it was Halo which came up with the idea of only being able to carry 3 weapons and a rechargeable

    shield and most FPS since then have copied the idea. So playing Doom and Halflife,you are playing

    the same game but there is a big difference between the two.

    Space sims on the other hand had most of the these gameplay elements back in the mid 90s,now some 15

    years later they are still using the same ideas. Is there any difference between Wing commander and

    Tarr chronicles or Elite and Darkstar1. ❓

    #70307
    AvatarShodex
    Participant
    PINBACK wrote:
    Empyrean wrote:

    but where FPS have evolved is in adding

    other elements to the gameplay over the last 20 years like physics, storylines the epic set peace even branching storylines.

    Agreed, don’t get me wrong I’m no FPS hater, Half-Life 2 is my favorite game of all time. But those things are more of the general gaming enhancements. If FPS didn’t adapt, then it would have fallen behind. Same goes for every genre.

    And sure, Space Sims are generally limited in environments. However, if the developers use their imagination Space Sims can have more variety. Take Miner Wars, it lets you cut through the asteroids and fly through there. You’re still in space, but it’s a creative environment. Space is called “the great unknown” for a reason, we really don’t know whats out there, developers can use that to their advantage.

    #70308
    farcodevfarcodev
    Participant

    the only logic in mainstream games is the economy: how much return on investment i’ll recover w” your shit ?

    When you understand that you understand fallout 3 (a rpg ? let me laugh), the plethora of fps w/ cod and the like (you play to one , you play to 10), the dumb down of the upcoming civilization 5, the non sense for the next ufo (thanks to the opensource project to continue to keep the REAL ufo alive) and again and again…

    So space sim hmmm, w/o orks, elves and nude women ? ouch and the player must think… it’s not really heavy in term of $$$$$$$

    SO do we REALLY need the mainstream market ?

    there’s a plethora of free games, from orbiter for the hardcore players-sim fans, to oolite.

    Sorry i’m a bit.. 👿

    Long live to the indie community

    #70309
    AvatarShodex
    Participant
    farcodev wrote:
    Long live to the indie community

    Amen.

    #70310
    PinbackPinback
    Keymaster
    farcodev wrote:

    SO do we REALLY need the mainstream market ?

    there’s a plethora of free games, from orbiter for the hardcore players-sim fans, to oolite.

    Sorry i’m a bit.. 👿

    Long live to the indie community

    You still need the mass commercial market, if these games are ever to make a come back, how many times have you seen on a forum this phase “I won’t play that game because the graphic are crap” of course this is utter nonsense, but the game industry has been able to convince the public that the only good game must come from the top deves and publishers.

    Shodex wrote:

    And sure, Space Sims are generally limited in environments. However, if the developers use their imagination Space Sims can have more variety. Take Miner Wars, it lets you cut through the asteroids and fly through there. You’re still in space, but it’s a creative environment. Space is called “the great unknown” for a reason, we really don’t know whats out there, developers can use that to their advantage.

    That’s pretty much what I feel, that deves have to look long and hard at the players environment, they have to get the wow back into these games. Give the player some thing they have not been able to do before, or bring back some of the older ideas.

    #70311
    CaptainKalCaptainKal
    Participant
    Quote:
    When you understand that you understand fallout 3 (a rpg ? let me laugh)

    ….Ehhmm, I really liked Fallout 3 😳 . And I think it’s still an RPG 😳 . (And yes I have played the original Fallout. I even found the waterchip :D) .

    #70312
    Avatarcultist
    Participant

    It`s not that is unpopular,its about paying a monthly fee on it,because all the good space sims are p2p or will be and generally you can’t fool hardcore space sim fans to pay to play.

    Make eve online free and you will see what happens

    Besides eve has a rather big pool of players even now.

    #70313
    PinbackPinback
    Keymaster
    cultist wrote:
    It`s not that is unpopular,its about paying a monthly fee on it,because all the good space sims are p2p or will be and generally you can’t fool hardcore space sim fans to pay to play.

    Make eve online free and you will see what happens

    Besides eve has a rather big pool of players even now.

    I think it’s the same for the online games; Eve has a big pool of players, but out of the top ten MMO it’s the only space sim one as all the rest are fantasy based games. Maybe with StarTrek and the new StarWars and BP games this might change this.

    #70314
    Avatarcultist
    Participant

    Im sure it will Pinback.

    I believe the sci fi fan base is big enough to sustain more than one game like eve,only if they will be free to play.There are a million fantasy games out there,but the only game that matters in that category is wow 🙂 the rest are struggling to survive.

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