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I use crypto.com app personally on a daily basis and its great and takes the stress out of learning crypto and the crypto debit cards are great, ask me anything on this. I will probably make a thread discussing crypto soon. REFERRAL CODE = p5mu64hcq4
 

Many new models of ships for the Pioneer.

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sapog662
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On behalf of our community, on the decision and with the consent of the authors officially declare:

 

0. Our friends Arn and Jahell decided to share with the project, the pioneer of your models

1. Transfer free of charge sharing for both projects, with the consent of the authors of the models and the proposal of the moderator of the project D3D - HeadHunter.

2. If any of the authors of models for the Elite D3D read all of this - ask the wish to share with the project, the pioneer of your models.

3. Need to find someone who will be engaged in the import models in the game. Maybe someone will understand and formats.

4. If you really want - modelers will try to send you a model in a more familiar format.

5. Change models and textures - on request.

6. If the models will be needed and will be used, perhaps other authors D3D, too, will give their model for the project (if we are able to communicate with them).

 

http://rusfolder.com/35055302

 

Pictures of models within the archive.


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Potsmoke66
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ok sapog "i was first"

 

no seriously, i was interested, but hmm... it's all in kyrillian letters, i mean a short advice how to download it would be helpful.

 

it starts with the capcha code...

 

i mean i didn't even see if i entered it right or wrong....

 

i can't speak or read russian, very problematic.

 

please help, which button do i have to press after entering the capcha code?

 

---

 

ok, i got it

 

a little help for the others...

 

when you open the link you get here

 

[attachment=1685:Bildschirmfoto 2013-02-19 um 20.34.20.png]

 

enter the capcha code you see in the apropriate field (of course).

 

press this button for "OK"

 

[attachment=1686:Bildschirmfoto 2013-02-19 um 20.33.28.png]

 

and you get to the site where the download should start in a few seconds.

 

---

 

thanks, i will examine it, you can be sure, maybe not today, i have a "mod" to prepare and some models waiting to get released.

 

[attachment=1687:preview_sport_outdoor.jpg]


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Potsmoke66
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and oh, can you explain this a little more,

it's a bit mixed up what you wrote,

 

what do you mean exactly with sharing to both projects (i have a idea.. but i like to see that in plain text)

 

and greez to jahell and arn

 

---

 

aha... and again a aha...

 

it's the stuff from FFED3D, well yes like it, is it "ready" to use or does "gernötli" need to take a look at it?

 

thus because scale of FFED3D and pioneer is a bit different.

 

in pioneer one meter is one unit

for ffe one meter is 0.1 unit.

 

besides of the slightly inconsistant scale of old FFE, i mean it's simply irrational that the "Constrictor" (90t) is nearly double in size to the "ASP" (120t).

just as a example, FFE has many ships out of scale.

but usually you won't notice (especially not when playing) before you examine them and hold the mesh of one over the other to compare the sizes.

 

though fact nr.1

 

FFED3D ships must be scaled up 10 times before they work with pioneer (no problem so far, i can do that in about 5 mins or so).

 

but there is finally a chance that arn and jahell could intervene and say, "hey yes i always felt this ship is to small or to large, ok can you scale it to "this and that" size.

 

i can, if you ask for it.

 

😉

 

 

have phun


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sapog662
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This model made for Elite3 D3D. The authors decided to offer these models to pioneer. But in Elite3 D3D they will be too.

 

You can correct these models, change the texture of your choice.


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fluffyfreak
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They're really nice models Sapog 🙂 thanks.


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Potsmoke66
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"nah, i wouldn't change a screw on it"

 

just as a sort of respect.

 

like i said i will convert them to the proper scale in no time, but really i nlike to give yours the chance to influence this, before i decide a own scale for them.

 

you must know i'm very displeased with the original scale of FFE.

 

---

 

you said "Elite 3 D3D" is there in general a difference to "FFED3D", or is it still the same "old" game? (more or less i mean)

i will see by checking out the models, of course.

but

i like to know this, because

i haven't visited "elite-games" since "aeons" and i have no idea what is going on in "väterchen russland" (mother russia).

 

---

 

further you spoke about "exchange", does that mean you like to get some of ours into "elite3 d3d", am i right?

and if, is there a specific one(s), you like to get?

 

probably a link to your actual site would be helpful to,

erm, not much news to see if i visit the "english speaking" thread of elite games, as far as something like that still exists.

we have a slight problem reading russian and i always be surprised to see some of you speaking english well.

most of us can't even uderstand "da" 😉

 

---

 

(little sidenote, guess how people in zurich looked at me when i wear my fur cap, likewise people talk in chinese with me when i cut off all my hair, they started to talk in russian with me with the proper hat on.

 

it's really funny to me (especially to me, seems a actor has got lost on me), i wear a hat and like "LEGO" the people think i represent the hat.

i wear a stetson, you can be sure each and everyone thinks i'm american,

i wear a fur cap, they think i'm russian,

if i cut off my hair and even worse if i leave a little pony, they think i'm a shaolin and start to bow in front of me (very annyoing).

 

also the fur cap is very handy, with that thing and the proper parka on, well each and everyone thinks i'm a cop, lol.

 

---

 

be happy that i have very little criminal energy, else...


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sapog662
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We do not need anything in return. And the reference to a site:  http://www.elite-games.ru/


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Rarog
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you said "Elite 3 D3D" is there in general a difference to "FFED3D", or is it still the same "old" game? (more or less i mean)

Hi all! It's FFED3D -
http://www.elite-games.ru/conference/viewtopic.php?p=2904071#2904071


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Potsmoke66
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thanks for clarifying this,

 

while, unfortunately, you may have noticed this already, things here start to go in a quite different direction.

 

means all "elite content" (whatever that is) will be removed.

 

i'm not happy about, you may have noticed this as well.

 

but it won't hinder me to include some to my "FFE mod".

 

which i already did, because i imported some buildings from FFED3D to my mod.

 

just because they fit much better as odd skyscrapers to a game like this, but with some you can't debate.

 

never was sure if you feel comfortable with it, but well no question anymore, you feel comfortable with it.

 

---

 

"freedom among the stars" yes, we could use some freedom...

 

this is all going to my head and i'm completely displeased with the situation.

it has turned to a nightmare, no joke.

 

---

 

some simply can't play fair...

 

---

 

unfortunately and that's also why i'm so disliked by some, i don't eat all you serve me.

you can't buy me not with money neither with false friendship.

 

gernot has to go, he's asks unpleasing questions and gives uncomfortable answers, we don't like, so we discredit him where ever we can.

 

but prob. they don't notice that their "imperial behave" is in the wrong place here.


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fluffyfreak
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You've never considered that perhaps there's good reason for not using someone else's IP?

That we're not saying everything for similarly good reasons?

That we're trying to do the right thing by a company who have been really good to us and so we're trying to be really good to them as a matter of mutual respect?

 

You can do whatever you like in mod, but we're not going to have it in the core of Pioneer so that others don't get pulled into future problems of conflicts or licensing agreements.

It's the best way for all of us right now and in the future.


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Vuzz
 Vuzz
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don't understand russian , and when i used traductor the widgets don't works , someone can explain to a frenchy how DL please ? 


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s2odan
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That we're trying to do the right thing by a company who have been really good to us and so we're trying to be really good to them as a matter of mutual respect?

 

 Care to elaborate on that?


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fluffyfreak
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Yes if It'd let me PM you 🙂


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walterar
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Why the mystery? Is there a business behind it?


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fluffyfreak
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@walterar,

No, it's just long winded and will open up more things that have to be discussed, which will mean more discussion and long winded talking to get to the same answer 🙁

I'm not sure you guys realise how much time has been spent discussing this today alone and how depressing this negativity is 🙁 🙁 🙁

 

There's nothing to stop anyone doing a mod of Pioneer based on whatever you like, you're scout mod for example is brilliant, but if Frontier models form the core of Pioneer then everything based off it is a derivative of Pioneer and hence Frontier. If Pioneer is it's own thing, it's own game, then that's not an issue anymore and that is a good thing.

 

The game itself will remain, it will be Pioneer and Pioneer is NOT Elite/Frontier/FFE. Whatever we do to change Pioneer you'll always be able to mod it into the game you want, so we want ship with Frontier models as a core part, but you're free to make any mod you want as everyone always has been and event o fork the entire thing and go it alone.

 

Andy


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fluffyfreak
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@Sapog,

There's a lot of great models in that package, I grabbed it last night.

I'm sure we can make use of a lot of them.

 

Are the authors interested in creating new ships for Pioneer/Elite3D3D?


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sapog662
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I'll ask right now.

We need guarantees that the whole business with the participation of our models will be possible only with the consent of their authors. That is a pioneer will remain a non-profit game.

Are you ready?


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Brianetta
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I'll ask right now.
We need guarantees that the whole business with the participation of our models will be possible only with the consent of their authors. That is a pioneer will remain a non-profit game.
Are you ready?

No, absolutely not. Pioneer's license is GPL version 3, and the assets are licensed under Creative Commons Attribution Share-Alike 3.0. Both of these licenses allow commercial, for-profit use. If the authors of those models will only consent under a non-commercial or non-profit license, then I'm afraid it can't be a part of the core game. It can be part of a mod, of course.


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fluffyfreak
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Pioneer is open source, not going to change, can't legally change as far as I'm aware! 🙂

If you attach a readme with the models, either individually or for all of them together, that says they're shared under the CC-BY-SA-3.0 licence that we use then they cannot be closed and if used in a closed source game then they still have to make those models available publicly.

We use that licence for all Pioneer models and assets and it's here:  https://github.com/pioneerspacesim/pioneer/tree/master/licenses  🙂

 

There are no plans to close Pioneer or make it commercial.


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sapog662
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If possible we will try to help. If you can give rules on how to do the model.


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Rarog
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It's a bit sad, because Elite to me something sacred.

But I understand the authors of Pioneer. And the Elite 4 in development. But somehow quickly removed all models. Without new. But the authors know better.

 

 

Are the authors interested in creating new ships for Pioneer/Elite3D3D?

Sorry for the link in Cyrillic. This was an administrative puncture. In the coming days I will try to upload the file to another location. 

About D3D. The problem is that the models were  made fans of the Elite and for Elite.

But development stopped - we do not have a programmer. Someone will make models for D3D - perhaps -  only if someone can fix even the basic error game. Modellers - fans of the Elite.

 

Now, some people are working on a new project - The Final Frontier. This rethinking of the Elite 3 - ie with a similar concept, but with the other models, space, etc. As now you want to change the Pioneer. But it's other people and they are not likely to give us a model for the Pioneer.

And D3D, again, for unfortunately - stalled.

 

The best we can do - to try to find new modelers. But I think that the people for it should be very ideological.

Sorry for my English. =)

And I'm sorry that I do not answer on all  posts in details - with my English is difficult.


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sapog662
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Hey! Is anybody home? What could I act, I need more information.))) What should be the ships in the game?


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Rarog
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New link http://www.sendspace.com/file/gdo7bb

 

P.S.> fluffyfreak


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fluffyfreak
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Cheers Rarog, downloading it now.

 

@sapog,

I PM'd you.


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Potsmoke66
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sapog,

 

in general you can make your models as for FFED3D,

that means pioneer supports now various mesh formats.

 

while "collada", is the chosen format to make things like variable materials (pattern bitmaps) and specularity bitmaps.

 

the scale is 1:1, means one unit is one meter, best is to work in units, thus the result will be proper scaled.

the orientation (also winding order) of the game is "RIGHTHANDED".

 

if it's not clear what that means,

lefthanded, take lefthand, point with forefinger away from you to mark "Z", thumb up will mark "Y" and spread middlefinger to right marks "X"

righthanded, take righthand, point with forefinger to your breast to mark "Z", thumb up marks "Y" and middlefinger will show "X".

 

that means in fact or simplyfied, our models are inverted over the "Z" axis compared to FFED3D or most modelling systems.

but you can use a simple 180° rotation over "Z", the UV is corrected so that will work best, while i found actually some issues prob. related to that,

but have to make this proof first. we haven't that problem before without matrix animations, but it seems it brings up some issues if i only rotate instead to invert over "Z".

you can say my fault, i introduced this rotating instead flipping, it was no problem for the LMR based animations, since you decided how the parts rotate/translate.

that is a bit different now and i guess the problem with the conrods and visual keying i have, are bound to this, but like i said i need more experiences in that direction.

 

to get one of the FFED3D ships running in pioneer "out of the box", not much is needed since .x meshes are supported.

open the existing FFED3D mesh in text format, there is a line on top of all meshes, which looks like this:


Frame RootFrame {


FrameTransformMatrix {
1.000000,0.000000,0.000000,0.000000, 0.000000,0.000000,1.000000,0.000000,0.000000, 1.000000,0.000000,0.000000,0.000000,0.000000,0.000000,1.000000;;
}

to get the model from lefthanded to righthanded system alter it in this way

 


Frame RootFrame {


FrameTransformMatrix {
-1.000000,0.000000,0.000000,0.000000, 0.000000,0.000000,-1.000000,0.000000, 0.000000,1.000000,0.000000,0.000000, 0.000000,0.000000,0.000000,1.000000;;
}

 

thus x and z get inverted, unfortunately left will become right

you need to invert "X" and "Z", obviously. else the normals will be wrong.

 

to scale the model to pioneer (ffed3d 0.1 units = 1 meter, pioneer 1 unit = 1 meter)

 


Frame RootFrame {


FrameTransformMatrix {
-10.000000,0.000000,0.000000,0.000000, 0.000000,0.000000,-10.000000,0.000000, 0.000000,10.000000,0.000000,0.000000,0.000000,0.000000,0.000000,1.000000;;
}

 

that's why i said cost's me 5mins to do so.

but in this way you can use the models without altering them or open the original project.

 

(and you pioneer devs, that's why .x meshes are cool in some sort you can't do that with collada, you can't alter scale or rotation everything gets mixed up)

 

while like i said scale of FFE is inconsistent, prob. one like to get the viper and the conny a little smaller and the cobra3 a little bigger.

(i recomend 8x for the viper and the conny and 12x for the cobra mk3, as example, but best would be compare the basic meshes in a CAD, lay one on top of the other and compare that to the specifications (mass) and you will see scale is inconsistent).

 

the advantage is portability of collada, means it's a format which can be ported to any OS and imported/exported form most CAD softs.

it offers unlike a .x mesh i.e. the possibility to open a model as if it would be a project, means you can work on it further even when you are not the author.

 

but i found out it's a bit difficult to animate the stuff (at least from my pov), collada stores all untransformed and animations work in a way very similar as they would work in the CAD, that's obvious else you couldn't open it like a project.

 

but exactly this brings up some issues, but best is find your own solution, i got stuck with conrods and haven't found a way to get them proper exported in collada.

that's why i use collada for the body mesh and .x meshes for the animated landing gear, that works best for me.

 

SGM supports Levels Of Detail, as much as you like.

 

from my pov. three LOD's are very good, two and prob. a collision mesh would be already enough.

 

means a low poly mesh for LOD1

and a higher detailed for LOD2

 

at which resolution the LOD will change, the modeller decides.

most what i did for SGM has actually 3 LOD's and a collision mesh, but like i said it's up to the modeller.

 

you can work without a collision mesh, pioneer will generate a box which covers the whole geometry if no collision mesh is present.

but since i'm a "tüfplischiesser" (one who shits dots) a very exact person, all my models have for sure a collision mesh close as possible to the shape of the ship.

i don't like to be prob. hit or collide where no hull is present, not even a cm, (i would like to get hit even on a lowered landing gear)

 

thrusters and other "variable" stuff are marked with "placeholders" means a empty node, scale of the node will be scale of what you call with it.

 

but well take this one prob. as example how it's done

 

[attachment=1691:mod_viper_coolhands5_sgm_30-1.zip]

 

erm, before i forgot

 

most models in FFED3D are stored as .bin or compressed .bin x-mesh

 

to get that to text format, you need either to open it i.e with max with the risk of loosing the animation.

but i recommend old "MeshView" from MS (DX8), with this proggy you can change them "lossless" from .bin to .txt.

 

a little teardrop.

 

pioneers SGM need material names in the mesh to assign the right material.

but as you can see at coolhands viper, if you use only ONE material it's not needed

to name it and one specified material will be used for all meshes.

 

---

 

BUT

SGM isn't complete (at least from my POV)

 

actually only a landing gear animation is supported,

you can call the same animated mesh twice (e.g. you like to have a visible landing gear at LOD2 as well at LOD3)

but specify the duration only ONCE, else it won't work.

 

neither you can have a LOD2 and LOD3 mesh incl. a landing gear that won't work.

 

leaks a lot, i feel, but i'm not asked i guess.

i don't understand why it has to be so simple?

 

ok. more modellers can do models, but i feel tomorrow SGM or any "old" modelling system is past.

costs time to learn something new, but what we have today can't be further developed.

but i feel the future will bring/need much more flexibility

 

"we don't like cockpits" is the wrong attemtpt i guess.

players today like already cockpits,

tomorrow they like to walk around in and outside the ship,

they like to do trips in 0 gravity,

and, and, and.

 

and besides of all that,

with the "shitty ancient LMR" or similar scripted assembling of a model, i can excavate a surface without leaving a single wrinkle on the surface.

try to do that in a other way without boosting the polycount, it's not possible.

i take a clean bezier surface and "dig" a hole in it, you won't see one single wrinkle around that hole, tricked yes,

but imo far better as the result of a boolean operation.

 

but take care i'm a uneducated construction worker and i have no idea about modelling.

my models are made "occasionally"

and at all i'm a idiot and a loud mouth.

thus because i'm a proletartian 😉

 

we have one he's 1000 times better as i am


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