My views on it...

As I said in another thread just re-make X2 with better graphics, expand the systems and add a new story. X2 had multi-ship ownership, EVA bits, unique cockpits and easy to understand trading and fleet management. Of all the X games it's X2 I got the furthest in. It felt just "right" to me. The X3 series was ok too but it just seemed lesser somehow than the 2nd game, lacking soul maybe of the older game. I can't quite put my finger on it. Somehow with X2 Egosoft kept the good things about the first games, got rid of the annoying things and put a lot of love into X2. With XR there are somethings that are cool, living stations and the look of the game are among them, they just need to somehow join X2 and XR together then they will have a great space sim in their hands in my view and also include better modding tools right from the off too because at the end of the day it's the Egosoft community that has kept these older games going for so long and improved them in many ways. It was also rumoured that XR was a failed console port. I don't know if that is true or not but if they want to make a console focussed game, state that from the beginning or develop it separately after a PC version. I'd recommend they do a PC version first if for no other reason than to keep their established community onboard with the franchise. Having a loyal community build up around your game (as Egosoft did with the older games) is extremely valuable and it's importance should never be dismissed as they can help a dev company in many ways. For what it is worth I wish Egosoft well as for quite a few years it was they (and a few others: Star Wraith Games, a number of East European & Russian  devs the the open source communities for example) that kept that space sim torch burning during the dark times when all the big devs had abandoned the genre. Basically I hope Egosoft's next X game will be a great addition to the series. Their fans deserve it and the genre deserves it!

I'm a bit skeptical about whether Egosoft can survive long enough to create a new game, especially one on the scale of any of the X games.  The disaster that was X Rebirth has certainly eroded their reputation to a pretty sorry state.  Even in the state it's in now (more or less bug-free), nobody seems to think it's "great", even if an increasing number of people think it's not completely terrible.

As for me, all I really want out of them is X3, with a radically, drastically improved user interface.  The unfathomably terrible UI has always made the X games much too difficult for me to enjoy.  The flight model has never been great, and it would be nice to drastically improve that as well, but for me X has always been more about the economics.

I know I haven't played this one yet because I have been waiting for patches and a new gfx card. But over the past year and my limited time playing the free weekend on steam I had a decent time with the game and cannot wait to give it a spin. Personally I think if they concentrated on stations and the interactions on them it would be a great improvement. All of the bug fixes have been great and the slowly improvements and adding of new features hopefully have helped rebuild the damage down with initial release like ExpandingMan mentioned.

I think Egosoft knows they have one more go around at this and this next game has to be truly good or ExpandingMan's thoughts I think will become fact. Egosoft has built their whole lively-hood around this game series and if they turn their player base away with bad releases or direction they will cease to be making games. I think the staff behind Egosoft are very good at space games its now just looking and listening to the player base to make 'their' game and they will throw money at you. Like Geraldine mentioned.... I myself have yet to actually complete a X game and I will give X-Rebirth a spin sooner or later and I hope I can finish one soon... specially since I own them all 🙂

Egosoft been around for 25 years and granted they seem to have spent the last 17 years making the same game over and over again, so I think there's a good chance that they will be back with a new X game in two to three years time. After all XR was not Egosoft first disastrous game launch, remember X3 although their is much more interest in these sorts of games now than their was back when X3 came out.

The real test for Egosoft now is will they be able to adapt and innovate in a new game as they will be facing a lot of competition some thing which for nearly a decade they did not have.

" Expanding and improving on the existing game " thats enough for me. They will keep going the  new way and im not going to follow.  The universe simulated there is amazing and I enjoyed greatly exploring and goofing around, but thats all for me as the  horrible UI and moronic modern "player ship  can win all"  idea  really puts me off. And they are going to expand over that crap.  Making empire/fleet management or allowing to fly more ships wont make it be X3 or X4.  Sorry if I sound too pesimistic or a troll but I  have zero faith in them  while they refuse to admit a big overhaul is needed. Just look at the computer assist off flight, its a minor thing that was already  tried in a mod ages ago, and yet its shown here as a  big step. Starshatter is more than 10 years old and it already had this in a way better form with AI making use of it too.

I would strongly encourage them to sort out all the crap they have now before thinking in going for  time/resources expensive expansions.  Doesnt matter the fact theres competition now, they still have the economy and ownership / building aspects no one else have, and they wasted their time trying to be like those other games instead of focusing on their own strong points. They better hurry up instead of another long dev period because  when they come back with a new empire or multi ship standalone DLC they will find the competition has already catched up with them and their game is no longer unique. Then migrating to making smartphone games comes next.

The drift mode a good point, it's some thing which should have been in the old games years ago but they have only just added it and probably because most other games have it.

So I would say competition is good if it bucks their ideas up, Egosoft have always been a bit of a plodder when it comes to doing anything new.

Unlike Geraldine, i got the most out of Albion Prelude. One of the main turnoffs through the years has been the steep learning curve. They'll need to streamline that somehow if they want to draw in new customers. Think a lot of the Rebirth sales were to people already familiar with the X franchise. Obviously, the star lanes was the dumbest thing they could have done, so it's good to hear they're at least looking at that.

Hopefully, if they've hinted at something new, it's already in progress. As mentioned earlier as well, they took a huge hit to their reputation when Rebirth came out. I played about an hour and couldn't stand it. Felt way too limited, especially after coming off of AP. Haven't read anything in their forums for a long time, so don't have a clue if they've fixed it somewhat or not.

I'd like to see a 4x by them. Would be interesting. But, as some people like a smaller universe idea, I loved the scope of X3 and actually would even like it bigger. I love to just get lost in games of mammoth proportions.

I'll certainly keep an eye out for whatever Egosoft decides to do.

I have always thought that the old series would make a better 4X or RTS game and it's something they could still do by setting the game in the same time line as XBTF to Albion or even pre XBTF.

Always been a surprise that Egosoft have never expanded the series to any other game genres, like for example CCP have done with Eve.

How about mixing the 2? Kinda like Shores of Hazeron did.

You have your first person flightsim experience. And then you can go in a sort of overhead view (you can even make it some sort of holographic hud idea or some holoroom you go into) and then control your ships in an RTS like way. The core mechanics for implementing this are already there. It'd just require some UI work.

 

As I said in another thread just re-make X2 with better graphics, expand the systems and add a new story. X2 had multi-ship ownership, EVA bits, unique cockpits and easy to understand trading and fleet management. Of all the X games it's X2 I got the furthest in. It felt just "right" to me.

 

I completely agree with you!

 

One of the main turnoffs through the years has been the steep learning curve. They'll need to streamline that somehow if they want to draw in new customers. Think a lot of the Rebirth sales were to people already familiar with the X franchise. Obviously, the star lanes was the dumbest thing they could have done, so it's good to hear they're at least looking at that.

I'm a X player since X2 and i loved egosoft games very much but i think Rebirth it's too complicated and boring.

No possibilities to use all the ships...this is the caracteristic sign of the X series! In X2 we had a cockpit for every ship, i hated X3 with no cockpits! Even if i'm a X player with Rebirth i found a lot of problems with economics and generally in the gameplay...it should be a disaster for a new player!

What about the combat part of the game? I'm not interested in economics...i build station only to earn some money to buy big ships and destroy xenon or kahaak capital ships...in the previous X chapters i have done a lot of dogfighting but in Rebirth fighting it's terrible! You can only mount a single cannon in one time, the ship sucks, the controls are bad....what had egosoft developers in mind? What they smoke usually?

So what i want is:

1.Good combat system....this is not a trade game it's a space sim!

2.Simple economics with a better learning curve.

3.I want to fly in every ship and all with cockpit.

4.Jump gates....i hate star lanes!

Not interested in planets so much.

A very large universe with landable planets and a lot fo star systems it's fantastic but details and graphics are worse since they have to do a procedurable game. It's also good to make a smaller universe but with very high graphic details.

Actually Rebirth it's not so good...it's a direct x 9 game, the graphic it's good but not so much if we think we are in 2016 and we have direct x 11 or 12. Graphic details on the stations are terrible!

I really would like to Egosoft be more open about what is going on with their upcoming game. Their forums is pretty much dead when it was still very active before X Rebirth. It would be great time to start build up the community again and gain some interest among space game fans. Open alpha versions and Early Access could be very good options for them. Community would help them with bugs by giving feedback. With more open development X Rebirth release would have been most likely much smoother release than it was now.

Being silent could be not the best option at the moment but I hope they know what they are doing ...

I completely agree with you!

 

 

I'm a X player since X2 and i loved egosoft games very much but i think Rebirth it's too complicated and boring.

No possibilities to use all the ships...this is the caracteristic sign of the X series! In X2 we had a cockpit for every ship, i hated X3 with no cockpits! Even if i'm a X player with Rebirth i found a lot of problems with economics and generally in the gameplay...it should be a disaster for a new player!

What about the combat part of the game? I'm not interested in economics...i build station only to earn some money to buy big ships and destroy xenon or kahaak capital ships...in the previous X chapters i have done a lot of dogfighting but in Rebirth fighting it's terrible! You can only mount a single cannon in one time, the ship sucks, the controls are bad....what had egosoft developers in mind? What they smoke usually?

So what i want is:

 

1.Good combat system....this is not a trade game it's a space sim!

2.Simple economics with a better learning curve.

3.I want to fly in every ship and all with cockpit.

4.Jump gates....i hate star lanes!

 

Not interested in planets so much.

A very large universe with landable planets and a lot fo star systems it's fantastic but details and graphics are worse since they have to do a procedurable game. It's also good to make a smaller universe but with very high graphic details.

Actually Rebirth it's not so good...it's a direct x 9 game, the graphic it's good but not so much if we think we are in 2016 and we have direct x 11 or 12. Graphic details on the stations are terrible!

Well, they could be silent because coming out with a statement such as "We just started to work on our next game. It is sheduled to come out some time after 2020, but you know us....there will be numerous delays." isn't the smartest thing to do and would make their forums even more dead.

Lets hope they go down the early access route, whenever they decide to do a new game.

Lets hope they go down the early access route, whenever they decide to do a new game.

Nah. Not interested. I prefer finished products to paying for becoming a lab rat.

A new game? Ok, very good. But Egosoft better hit the right trend this time not deceiving their fans anymore, most of them are spiritually stucked in the X3 world and its features, but I hardly imagine that Ego will return to such a game system, why doing such a game twice?

A very big world with solar systems and planets in it? Also very hard to imagine, Ego would have to completly revamp the old game engine, this is expensive unless they take an engine under license which would not be a bad thing, why re-inventing the wheel over and over... But this would only be a plus for them if they introduce some decent FPS actions which I don't believe they'll ever do. I don't believe I will ever evade some pirates in a buggy on a planet surface for example...not in an Egosoft game.

I can however imagine a 'simplified' planetary world where factories or other special structures are visited and can be built on the surface, maybe some hardpoints to attack and a landscape that gives the player tactical opportunities to use the terrain as a shield in air-to-air engagements. It would point towards an analogue system to the space station building in X-Rebirth, but expanded on planets, I think this is more realistic considering the current game state of the previous titles.

XenonS

I completely agree with you!

 

 

I'm a X player since X2 and i loved egosoft games very much but i think Rebirth it's too complicated and boring.

No possibilities to use all the ships...this is the caracteristic sign of the X series! In X2 we had a cockpit for every ship, i hated X3 with no cockpits! Even if i'm a X player with Rebirth i found a lot of problems with economics and generally in the gameplay...it should be a disaster for a new player!

What about the combat part of the game? I'm not interested in economics...i build station only to earn some money to buy big ships and destroy xenon or kahaak capital ships...in the previous X chapters i have done a lot of dogfighting but in Rebirth fighting it's terrible! You can only mount a single cannon in one time, the ship sucks, the controls are bad....what had egosoft developers in mind? What they smoke usually?

So what i want is:

 

1.Good combat system....this is not a trade game it's a space sim!

2.Simple economics with a better learning curve.

3.I want to fly in every ship and all with cockpit.

4.Jump gates....i hate star lanes!

 

Not interested in planets so much.

A very large universe with landable planets and a lot fo star systems it's fantastic but details and graphics are worse since they have to do a procedurable game. It's also good to make a smaller universe but with very high graphic details.

Actually Rebirth it's not so good...it's a direct x 9 game, the graphic it's good but not so much if we think we are in 2016 and we have direct x 11 or 12. Graphic details on the stations are terrible!

Everybody's different I guess. Yes, Rebirth sucks...hard. Lanes? No. They messed up most of the rest of it as well. However, I preferred X3, esp. Albion Prelude way over previous X's.

1. I Loved the combat, but equally loved the complex trading systems, building factories, etc.

2. Again, I could handle even more complex economics. A space sim doesn't have to be limited to combat only. The more variables, the more approaches in play styles.

3. Yes, ability to fly every ship, and withh a variety of cockpits is very cool.

4. Yes, not only free-flying within a sector, but jumpgates. No lanes!

I didn't think AP's universe was big enough! hahaha I get bored with smaller, confining feeling areas of exploration, no matter a game's genre. X3's universe wasn't procedurally generated, so it doesn't mean that their planets have to be either. I also like XenonS's, "I can however imagine a 'simplified' planetary world where factories or other special structures are visited and can be built on the surface, maybe some hardpoints to attack and a landscape that gives the player tactical opportunities to use the terrain as a shield in air-to-air engagements. It would point towards an analogue system to the space station building in X-Rebirth, but expanded on planets, I think this is more realistic considering the current game state of the previous titles." Great ideas for planets without being too overly complicated (or having to be random-genned.

Nah. Not interested. I prefer finished products to paying for becoming a lab rat.

That's the problem both XR and X3 were supposed to finished and both had a huge amount of patches released in order to make the games playable.

If Egosoft are making another game then they want to do a lot more testing before releasing it.

That's the problem both XR and X3 were supposed to finished and both had a huge amount of patches released in order to make the games playable.

 

If Egosoft are making another game then they want to do a lot more testing before releasing it.

They were buggy, but at least they were 95% feature complete on the release day whereas most Steam EA "products" are in a much worse state with barebones gameplay mechanics and little to no content.

Alfa beta or other pre-releases are always a prime excuse for features not being there or such ones not working well. A lot of games will remain pre-releases forever I think, the authentic aim to get funded with this system is biased. I too prefer to buy a finished product that will be improved further if need be. With X-Rebirth we had to go from the catastrophic release to v.2 then up to v.4 to see a good game. Eventually a lot of features and content have been added, but I hope the new game will not show the same curve.

XenonS

Alfa beta or other pre-releases are always a prime excuse for features not being there or such ones not working well.

Hmmh, why do you think they are excuses? Alpha version is not ready but under development and that's why the product most likely doesn't work as expected.

Early Access doesn't force anyone to support the project. Those who wants to wait the final release are able to do so. Early Access gives players change to support the project, help developers and give them valuable feedback.

Many software projects fails and Early Access projects are no exception: http://calleam.com/WTPF/?page_id=1445

Hmmh, why do you think they are excuses? Alpha version is not ready but under development and that's why the product most likely doesn't work as expected.

 

In this case, why releasing the game then? Better release it when reasonably polished and ready to play. No sorry, I see only few exeptions where pre-releases make sense, also from marketing point of view. The game needs to be in a good state already and not run the player into trouble that will get him away from the title.

Empyrion Galactic Survival is a 'good' example for a pre-release, others generally are not. The overall economic market principle applies whether you invent alpha, beta or other Kickstarter-like pre-releases: In my profession (language and communication), I cannot do half of the work and ask others to help me, even for a discounted final price. That's ridiculous. I'll have to do my job at 100%. The same applies for gaming articles: if you release an alpha game you are asking the gamers to pay for it and to help the developers. Humm.... Generally the market says you get paid when working, not the contrary...

Then, in spite of pre-release you can do as Rodina does: it's a full released game ready to play, but because features will be added then the price tag is appropriately low to start with. And a full release doesn't surely hamper player's feedback, there is a lot of such in Egosoft games, and the devs listen I think.

XenonS

In this case, why releasing the game then? Better release it when reasonably polished and ready to play.

Why wouldn't game developers release their games? Its their professions and their name/face, reputation and career depends on it.

So what's wrong with giving players to help testing and giving feedback during the development cycle?

I tested X Rebirth Linux alpha version and sent developer feedback about issues I found. I'm doing that with Star Citizen and I would do that with a new Egosoft X-game as well if it would be possible - voluntarily, for free. It is common in open source development as well.

Early Access is a great way to support projects you care about financially:

http://www.pcgamer.com/wasteland-2-early-access-sales-helped-double-the-games-kickstarter-budget/

In most cases crowdfunding / Early Access is the only way developers are able to develop and publish their games. Crowdfunding has been a huge success on PC and it has brought us many good games and more to come.

I can however imagine a 'simplified' planetary world where factories or other special structures are visited and can be built on the surface, maybe some hardpoints to attack and a landscape that gives the player tactical opportunities to use the terrain as a shield in air-to-air engagements. It would point towards an analogue system to the space station building in X-Rebirth, but expanded on planets, I think this is more realistic considering the current game state of the previous titles.

You can see them doing some thing like that as it would fit into the X game world and given that most of their competition are already doing planets, if they go in that direction.

Why wouldn't game developers release their games? Its their professions and their name/face, reputation and career depends on it.

 

Very fine, they should go on (but see next response).

 

 

So what's wrong with giving players to help testing and giving feedback during the development cycle?

 

What's wrong is. they charge for it to get help. Is Pioneer charging anything? No.. A game is ready to be paid for or: it is not.

My response is in the quote, sorry...

I'm not contrary to any pre-release of course, but for beta releases and such there must be a serious reason for the dev to do so AND it must make sense for him as for sellings in the future. My guess is that such pre-releases you see on Steam (Valve) are all over the place, biasing any serious intentions to improve the titles further, not every game author has this aim, but it's just the impression I have when browsing.

XenonS