SpaceSimCentral

Ok, clouds aside we do have some other stuff to consider.People seem mostly concerned about what happens within the areas defined by the factions - ships available, buildings selection in cities, police and military ships and textures.Trade too could could get a boost if we defined goods costs and availability differently across factions.Is there anything else we need to know about the factions themselves? I'm trying to make a list of properties that a faction will then have so a list off the top of my head might be:[*:22trlbcj]faction name[*:22trlbcj]short description[*:22trlbcj]longer backstory-like description[*:22trlbcj]home world/star-system location[*:22trlbcj]founding date[*:22trlbcj]rate of galactic expansion[*:22trlbcj]military name[*:22trlbcj]military logo[*:22trlbcj]police name[*:22trlbcj]police logo[*:22trlbcj]goods/equipment availability (
1-per-economy-type: aka agricultural, industrial, tourist, etc)[*:22trlbcj]goods/equipment legality[*:22trlbcj]ship availabilityI figure that building would list what factions they were under rather than factions listing what buildings since there'd be a lot of buildings common to both! likewise with ships, police textures/versions of ships would be listed on the ship rather than the faction itself.I'm not yet decided on the best method of defining the volumes of space that belong to each faction but I have some ideas and will keep plugging away at it before I spout off on here.So, is there anything else you think a faction should define? i.e. a faction actual information beyond it's name location and description? Or is there something on that list that you don't think makes sense.I'm really trying to involve everyone in this since it could be such a fundamental part of the game.Andy

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faction nameshort descriptionlonger backstory-like descriptionhome world/star-system locationfounding daterate of galactic expansionmilitary namemilitary logopolice namepolice logogoods/equipment availability (1-per-economy-type: aka agricultural, industrial, tourist, etc)goods/equipment legalityship availability
i guess if we leave some aside, or concentrate on what's important, we get a good stat with thatpriorities, imo- home world/star-system location- rate of galactic expansion- goods/equipment availability, legalityi think with that it should be possible to give the factions a shape, the rest can be defined later imo, when the framework is built.if you don't mind, i wouldn't concentrate to much on the how or with what i can generate factions rather to do it simply, with whatever method is reachable to me.shouldn't be a big thing to have three factions and a space distributed between them, what method, algorithm you will use is secondary to me.in the end we have two or three factions, simply plotted with a "pencil" or clever generated, it doesn't matters much to the player in the end.or in other words the player won't notice what's behind usually, as long as the things arn't to obvious he didn't recognizes if it's "hard plotted" or generated.ergo we could say you could simply draw/plot the factions by "hand" and it won't differ much to a far off algorithm, while of course i think the latter is cooler to have.i don't mind if they are grown or appear like real grown factions, that's cool stuff but secondary imo. btw, a player playing the game won't notice it, well perhaps after playing the game repetively for years as we all did with FE2.something to think of at this point is if the factions should be dynamic, if they should interact with the player or his decisions he made. at least it would have to be set already to leave the opinion.to me it appears a bit like the board i made for the boardgame, if we have the board (environment) we can start to think of obstacles.if there is a way to make the environment depending on decisions, even better, likewise i didn't prescripted the fields and cards to buy we had more rather fields, no game appeared twice the same. the path was given but the conditions varied each game a little, because you played the game.if i think that i only took some elements known to me from computer games and simplified it for a boardgame...a lot of the environment is already here, we only have to use it, imo. simple or advanced use, i don't mind in the end (i prefere simple )if we can have generated factions with a history which is grown, wow that's amazing i would like to have that to, that's your artistry and i understand also the longings to get that working. it will be outstanding.not to mix the factions with the missions stuff, i will post some additional suggestions to the "roleplay- boardsgame elements" thread i opened.because i feel, this here is really important, it's the shape of the "board" we are working on here. the core of the game if you like.anything else is secondary imo.i know many missions and even my idea for quasi generated missions or better little events which build something like a mission, don't need any factions.they will work without such, BUT it makes the thing far more interesting to have them, they build a additional own environment in the existing one.open a lot of doors for ideas and are something like the "heartbeat" of the game.the thing that let's you move on* , likewise to get rich in the boardsgame, you evolve.*at least for those who didn't have to get rich essentially, i guess i played FE2 only once as "freighter captain", after i have had owned every ship of FE2 i never did that again, i concentrated only on the missions (which are in FE2 truely based only on the existing factions) and got rich by the way.if i play it now, i usually have no idea what to do with the money except to donate it, also because i use a rather cheap vessel to do all missions, no heavy shielded panther "cheat". besides of that i can't think of a mission not to complete in FE2 with a small powerful ship, while with the panther you wil be very limited and the "flying stations" as well stations on planets with high gravity are out of reach.[/hr]time to fly... just walk,i remembered a cybernetical problem which is already a old one, it's the way how arthropods walks, they have no brain no central nerve to control the synchronisation between the single working limbs. each is standalone but it works all together because they work after the same scheme.

One thing that might be nice is if your reputation is based partly on what faction you are from. You might have a choice of starting positions similar to the three we have now but each is in a different faction. A flag is set in your saved games based on which starting position you picked. If you travel to another faction's territory you might get a "You're not from around here" type suspicious reaction from people when applying for missions, lower pay, or some people might refuse to deal with you. Police might be more likely to search your ship. Illegal goods traders might offer lower prices or not even deal with you. The strength of the reaction would be based on the level of hostility that exists between the faction you're from vs. the one you are in. Your reputation could improve over time or get worse based on your actions.

player related, a simple counter you could saystart with i.e. 0 pts count in all other factions rather your own, each successful contract adds some value to reach at least i.e. 100 for "fair" or higher for "well". easy no?player relatedadd/discount some to "players faction value" probably add/discount some to "players overall reputation"we would have only one "players faction value" which simply has a negative value in the other faction?we only need a value i can use later on in a next event (mission is related to "faction". if "players faction value" is #n then ... else ...)mission relatedadd/discount some to "players mission" counter, next step is perhaps locked because it needs a higher mission value (simple reputation, only valid in a single mission).or better split, if you reach the needed pts. go on, if not, do it again or do something special. but you the "cards writer" will decide what's to do.faction (game world) relatedplayers faction is? to this faction is a value added or discountedfrom on certain negative or positive counts something changes (i.e. factions expansion, changes availability of goods/equipment)while not all events are relative to all, some will result only in "players reputation"but sometimes i feel i spoke out only well known old stuff...anyway factions will boost the possibilities you have (argh, as if there wouldn't be enough)of course one very important thing we need first,the "character", who? faction? is-female? eyecolor ? birthdate? whatever you like, only some given info to your person, to get some numbers from that. especially the chosen faction is "player related", means a faction can change, you choose one to start, add or even discount from the relative counter while you play, if you go beyond a given value you loose faction relation and of course above you get member, while in this system you can work for both factions but the value counts negative in the opposite faction. that will mean you are after a while a true "federal" while the value on the other faction is that "low" you never get out of that.that will strongly limit some actions, but on the other hand, i know a lot of players are dissatisfied with "you can work for both factions without getting punished for".that would really mean, either we have only black and white, so the decision is easy,or a third faction like the "independent" which will be probably the starting faction and default to it if you reached zero (or any given value) in your faction."independend" should be more or less not be influenced by your "players faction value", except perhaps as a general reputation, i.e. a known "War Lord" can't make a caritative mission like "carrying whales from A to B", or save population from station X, no matter how i boosted my "players reputation" with i.e. donations.i would like that, because as a decided imperial* all this will be locked to me, except i "degrade" to a independend again, (but who likes to throw away his career?).it would also mean i have to start the game in each faction, or work for each faction to get through all missions we will have (in future, ).double crossing spys are perhaps to handle extra, but it would need a extra player counter to note how often you changed the sides.or a "player faction value" for each faction, but imo that's a useless complification. but it's to think about if we like to have more then two opponents.for two and a third independend one "player faction value" will work.and perhaps we can juggle additionaly with the money one makes, or donations he made...while the money is "player related" as well as "mission related" or "game world related".that isn't really new no? but perhaps i helped where to start, that would be already fine. 8-)at least i could perhaps made the idea a little user friendly (without the printed label "100% user friendly")[/hr]*i like to play the "bad one", must be because i always had to as a child, everybody choosed the allies i had to play the role of the axis. it was really a problem for me as a child, but of course not yet anymore, i started to like it. playing the role of the bad is as good as the good, perhaps even better.in certain games you make a dice roll to decide "black or white" i don't need, give me the black please! (if you really feel it makes a difference?).i even think the whole procedure to start a ma-jongg is a complete, ah, you know what i mean.

Just a trivial visual thing, but I could make some varying clothing and accessory styles for each faction in the facegen. I've had no time at all to work on it lately, but I do plan to clean the whole thing and make it look more "finished" aswell.

I don't think that would be trivial at all. Different uniforms for the police, military and station personnel would be especially welcome. Faction fashions frankly feel fabulous! As for cleaning things up, some of those people look like they need it![attachment=1183:Vicky_Harris.jpg]I love finding stuff like that!

HAHA I'll have to add in some more of that kind of stuff then. Different uniforms is a fantastic idea too! I'd like to hopefully have someone add code to make the stock market traders visible at some point aswell.

Lawful stock market traders should be suited, cargo handlers could be overalls and pirates could have a black dark outfit with eye patch or some other pirate type looks

Marcel wrote: I love finding stuff like that!
Great find! I have a mate with that name and purple/pink hair haha She doesn't attract flies though

Started this work today :)Got some basic data loading in from Lua files and need to add the planet specific market type information etc and then begins the process of determining what faction type a system will be etc.For the non-C++ peeps, of whom I hope there are many, I'll be doing it in stages and separate parts. So there's getting the basic faction data in, then a system for determining what factions volume of space a star system is inside, then the using that data for setting up the system/prices/legal-trading/etc.Dunno how long all of this will take as my job has me travelling for the next few days and then... well then I might be looking for a new job again, there are times I really wish I'd picked a more stable career! Ah well, people keep wanting to hire me, it's the gaps between that are killing my bank account!laters!

Andy, you keep working on this? I have some doubts about how to access factions data, from lua.

Yes I still work on it from time to time. It's a bit complicated at times which is why I've not got to the point where submitting a pull request would make sense.What doubts do you have?I started with the Lua and putting the data into the game. It's how I approach things, start at both ends and work towards the middle <img src="'[url]http://spacesimcentral.com/forum/public/style_emoticons//wink3.gif[/url] class='bbc_emoticon' alt=';)' /> then once I've figured out how to join them up I go back and analyse what happens to the data to see if there's a better way of doing it.Unfortunately I'm still at the beginning bit of getting data into it <img src="'[url]http://spacesimcentral.com/forum/public/style_emoticons//wink3.gif[/url] class='bbc_emoticon' alt=';)' />Andy

I can read: Game.system.lawlessness and Game.system.population but my doubts on how to access the constants "PolitBloc", "PolitEcon" and "PolitGovType".

I might need to extend some other systems then. Not to worry.

A patch will be welcome. <img src="'[url]http://spacesimcentral.com/forum/public/style_emoticons//good.gif[/url] class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':good:' />

Andy, you who have spent so much time on this should know what functions (possible) needed by applications (in Lua, Python, etc) of the kernel (Pioneer).Discussed this before? If anyone knows where I can find that information, I appreciate it.I regret that you do not understand Hispano Americano, I could dwell on it further. <img src="'[url]http://spacesimcentral.com/forum/public/style_emoticons//mail1.gif[/url] class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':mail:' /> <img src="'[url]http://spacesimcentral.com/forum/public/style_emoticons//sarcastic_hand.gif[/url] class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':sarcastichand:' />

Sorry Walterar I don't quite understand what you're asking.Do you mean what functions I should add or what functions already exist? Or something else entirely?

What features should be added.I'm playing with the new game Achernar from hithub, fantastic!

Sorry, I'm interested in exploring this new system, do not wait for dinner. <img src="'[url]http://spacesimcentral.com/forum/public/style_emoticons//crazy_pilot.gif[/url] class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':crazypilot:' />

Andy, I have hours of play in the new system and would be very good inclusion to Alpha 26.But back to the topic.I can read: Game.system.lawlessness and Game.system.populationMy question is if there is someone working on the code to:Game.system.politblocGame.system.politeconGame.system.politgovtypeetc.Walter