SpaceSimCentral

A smart man once said, don't speak out the obvious it makes you look dumb. I do it anyway: Pioneer is a great game and there are for sure many cool indie space game projects out there which also are,but I'm afraid the most of them will become obsolete when Elite: Dangerous' retail version will come out because they all look very similar. Is there a possibility that Pioneer gets so much individuality in the future to be worth playing or does it need something complete different? It probably needs something unique because it can't compete with ED in things like graphics, gameplay, game world,it seems it's the end of the line of what you can achieve in such a scenario. I for myself have not that clear vision of how it should look like but I have a few ideas. Otherwise there should be no drastic change if the developers want this game evolving in this Elite 2 style, if this is what they have always wanted. But if it isn't the case I am for a different approach. Not only to have something new but also to see what is possible.My (selfish) idea is to concentrate even more on the simulation aspect.Get rid of the most gamey parts and handvavium as possible.Only things which can actually exist.This changes would mostly effect combat and travelling.There is no problem with empires and great wars, maybe humans are still militant in year 3200.Altough this would be a shame.But great wars in computer games are always thrilling. Does someone share this opinion or have other ideas? If there is already a similar discussion going on forget this thread. (hey a rhyme  ,almost) 

That is not what I would like to see, the "handwavium" and gamey aspects are there to make it enjoyable. Orbiter and other games are also occupying the hardcore aspects already so if we did start developing that direction we'd just be moving from one occupied position to another. I think we're similar, still too similar in areas, to Elite:Dangerous - however we are different and becoming more so every day.

am i allowed to mediate?following won't be my personal view to it. i guess in some aspects i like your idea "zzz".i remember that walterar once said he would like a less violent game, if i remember right he introduced pioneer to his grandson (right?).i know a second one who never liked the violent aspect of the game to well. i think i wouldn't like to get rid of the "handwavium" elements, it's fiction and such belongs there or else you can trash the whole idea of hyperspace (subspace? doesn't matters). it could take without such a little long to get to "proxima" already. the idea of a less violent pioneer sounds good to me.in other terms exploration would prob. become the hub instead. this will be my personal view;on the other hand prob. both can exist parallel, it's "you choose your carreer" which i like a lot, maybe to fine violent behave? this i would appreciate a lot.i.e. you simply count the violent behave, a certain mission could become unavailable for you if you act to often violent, or you get punished more and more by pirates, just like on your head would be a bounty, i always liked this idea. act nice and you get honored, act violent and you get punished.very early i suggested such, of course this means we (you) would represent a certain morality, some won't like this i guess.

@fluffyfreak Sorry that you are upset. I realized it's so quiet here the last weeks and I don't want this project becomes neglected.So I took my chance.You know everybody wants to make "his"/"her" game to be made.If I were a programmer I would go for it for myself and make a mod to see if my ideas would work. Maybe I should dig in that coding thing. Sorry again. @Gernot A peaceful Galaxy would be great!

Upset? Not upset at all, certainly nothing to apologise for zzz

Then I am relieved.

From my POV Pioneer should be as much simulation as it can possibly afford to without wrecking its premise.Pioneer's premise is "humanity has settled a chunk of galaxy and you have a lot of privately owned spacecraft flying around in and between systems, doing all sorts of things including resorting to violent crime via the means of relatively close range dogfights".Essential handwavium in that scenario consists of some sort of FTL (the more limited the better) and some sort of planetside defenses for preventing anyone with a spaceship and a desire for genocide-suicide from taking a running start and wrecking an inhabited planet (else it's like letting anyone buy an ICBM).Non-handwavium but still problematic stuff includes reasonable conventional drive technology, worthwhile interstellar trade and, of course YARR!That's it.Pioneer's FTL inherited from Frontier is pretty ingenious in that it's inherently imprecise making it difficult to use for other things than travel, some handwavium, possibly using FTL-like tech and being difficult and costly could be written into fiction (and possibly implemented in game) to destroy ships on collision course with planet without leaving relativistic debris to hit it. Other than that, handwavium should be eliminated with extreme prejudice.This also means that simulation elements are welcome. Orbiter may already exist but Orbiter with procedurally generated galaxy teeming with life, interstellar travel and wide variety of careers from peacefully mining to pewpewing pirates for bounties does not.There is this niche between space fantasy and documentary where all the best sci-fi lies.This niche is pretty much devoid of games, especially space sims - time to change that.

 X serie The x series should be transferred into the star trek universe with the ferengis.

@zzzdo i hear sarkasm? have only played X, about any sequel i can't say nothing.i guess the idea to build your own industry isn't bad.the limited space and the starports was also a big dislike.nonetheless i liked to play it, but it's quite a while ago. i guess, but this i even didn't played since aeons, SW-XWA i like better, spaceflight is totally unrealistic,but the missions are cool.