SpaceSimCentral

So... the new movie was huge, Star Wars is popular again and Disney is making boatloads of money off of Star Wars... but is it all worth it? I'll admit, I was drinking while writing this, so please excuse any grammar or spelling mistakes. I can't excuse the bitterness, I'm bitter aboot this, even sober. -Pros of the new canon: *The Clone Wars: the movie that started it was surprisingly good for something that was marketed towards kids and the show itself followed in a surpisingly dark, gripping and developing story. I remember when I saw the first decapitation, I was so stunned because I knew it was meant for kids! *Rebels: It isn't starting out as strong as the Clone Wars and eventually Kanan, Ezra and Ahsoka will have to die to go hand in hand with ANH, but it's starting to turn into a great show. Both the new shows could've easily gone hand in hand with the old EU.... Cons (the main reason for this thread): -Disney destroyed the EU, not just post ROTJ, which I was expecting for the most part, with a few things hopefully staying, but even pre TPM. There was no need to get rid that. The Old Republic era isn't even canon anymore and that was on the level of the original trilogy, and in some aspects even better. The Mandolorian Wars, 100 year darkness are all canon, but the best parts aren't. Darth Bane was rewritten and holy shit is it terrible! -The new books: ugh... I've heard EU fans love Aftermath, but evrything else, even the comics are just mediocre at best. We get recycled EU elements, but with terrible writing. "Help us, Timothy Zahn ,you're our only hope." -We lost many great characters... Kyle Katarn, mara Jade (shes still canon, but we probably won't see her with Luke at all), Thrawn, Revan, Plageus, Bane, Exar Kun, Pellaeon, Desann, Jacen and Jaina Solo, the Yuzzhan Vong and lots more of great characters and story arcs. - De-canonizing the comics, LucasArts games and the best novels. I understand.... Disney wants to make as much money ASAP, but they would've been LOVED by fans if they kept the good stuff canon and just got rid of the shit. Frankly these were the best parts of the EU. Disney made no new fans doing this. They didn't de-canonize the Marvel multiverse (not even a Marvel fan, and I know this), so why Star Wars, which is considerably bigger and has more fans?! -The Force Awakens.... oh boy, it's great on the factor of nostalgia, but if you were looking for a great Star Wars story prepare to be pissed! The New Canon: I've been trying to get into the new canon, it's just bad... It has mostly been Poorly written concepts from the EU..... I heard Aftermath was fantastic, even for EU fans, but even if the admiral at the very end turns out to be Thrawn, it'll still be plagiarism. I feel so sorry for the many talented authors who spent their time writing for something they loved. RIP TImothy Zahn and New Jedi Order novels and many others. 1. 99% of the story elements were taken from the EU. Starkiller Base: Obviously it was based off the Death Star in looks and "design," but the weapon itself was based off the Galaxy Gun with hints of the Sun Crusher. It was a stationary weapon that fired a hyperspace beam, but with hints of the Sun Crusher, it had to recharge with a sun (sun crusher didn't need to, but I can see the influence the idea had) and it could destroy a whole Solar System (like the Sun Crusher) and that was actually a cool idea. It wasn't orginal though. Having it look like the Death Star was an obviously cash in. Kylo Ren: The son of Han and Leia, he is obviously based off of Jacen Solo/Darth Caedus but he is a bitch. Worshipping Vader was a cool aspect, but being manipulated and controlled by Snoke was just lame. We don't need another Vader, make the dude different. Unlike many people, I did like how he had temper tantrums (he is a Skywalker afterall), but he tried to keep control of himself, so you can obviously see he has a lot of inner turmoil, as he is a dark jedi, but he goes in a rage mostly when others aren't around. killing Han was a good touch, as it adds character to him. His character was also like Desaan from Dark Forces: Jedi Knight 2: jedi outcast (i know its not called dark forces technically, but fuck you, it is). he was Lukes student but massacred the academy. I also found it unrealistic that he killed EVERYONE. Why couldn't Luke stop him from killing some of them. Other than nostalgic fan service, why did Luke go into hiding? This was just another example of poor writing. Even I liked his character, but.... Jacen Solo from the EU is a lot better. Rey is obviously like Jaina Solo: While Rey is probably Luke's son and he just wiped her mind or even possibly Han/Leias Daughter but still had the mind wipe and they know. She was this stupidly boring "Mary Sue" character. She had no flaws, she could seemingly untrained beat kylo (sure after he was shot and slashed, but still....), use force persuasion (how the fuck did she even know how to do it) and center herself in the force. It'll probably turn out that she was trained but had her mind wiped, just like Revan, but if she isn't she is just a horribly written character. Finn: Before the halfway point he was a great character. Tortured by what he saw in his first battle, and decided to go against it.... Then he was turned into comedy relief... It also looks like he is the only original character in TFA. Poe Dameron: I like the character, but this guy is obviously just a copy/paste of Wedge Antilles with some characteristics of some EU pilots from the X Wing books. Don't really have any concerns with him other than that. The Resistance: This was something obviously created just for nostalgia for the Rebel Alliance. Why the hell is there a resistance?! The New Republic was formed from the Rebel Alliance, why the fuck is this even a thing!? It's pointless. This is the thing that really bothered me. There is no point to have a resistance when there is the New Republic... blah blah blah politics, sure whatever but still it would be more reasonable to just have the resistance be a part of the New Republic military instead of just another faction. The First Order: Obviously taken from the imperial remnant concept. I do hope there are other Imperial factions though. If there wasn't a power split in future movies and books, that will just be poor writing. Snoke: If he is a completely new character then fuck him, whatever, poor writing, blah blah blah. But he really has to be an older character with a new/fake name to be taken seriously for older fans. The Plageus theory is good, but if hes new, than just... ugh.. Sith shouldn't just spring up out of fucking nowhere for reasons. General Hux: Other than Finn, I loved this guy. he was obviously a play on Tarkin, but despite his age (though I could take him more seriously if he was older) he was absolutely FANTASTIC. I just hope he isn't a replacement for Grand Admiral Thrawn. LucasFilms will be making a huge mistake if he is. Han Solo: Why the fuck did he go back to smuggling?! He was a fucking war hero and helped form the New Republic? This was just a lazy attempt to cash in on nostalgia. Fuck this. Maz Kanat: Obviously supposed to be a Yoda like character. Not simply because of the age, but her "knowledge" of the force. It was unnecessary to have her be like this. Anakin's Lightsaber: This was fucking STUPID! Luke dropped it on Bespin which is a FUCKING GAS PLANET/GAS GIANT! This was just pure fan service through-and-through. The Millenium Falcon: Just like Han and Chewie going back to smuggling, this was also stupid. Han losing the falcon for reasons?! Really?! The First Order even knew about the Falcon, it was a famous ship. poor writing just to get the plot rolling. Knights of Ren: I hope this is a cult based off of Revan, but with the name changed a bit. Otherwise the cult just seems pointless... Luke Skywalker: Going into exile like Yoda: Fan service!!!!!!!!! Also it was mentioned that he was searching for the homeworld of the Jedi.. It fucking better be Tython and not some new planet. Jakku: Nostalgia... Nostalgia everywhere... "Lets make a Tatooine-like desert planet just to appease fans." Terrible Soundtrack: I'd like to think that the directors and producers had a say on the sound they wanted, but I have to say, this was John Williams worst soundtrack. Even for the prequels, those were possibly his best, even if the movies themselves were mediocre at best (great plot, just awful writing). I felt half of the soundtrack was supposed to be a homage to the original trilogy soundtrack, which for music wise is a great thing, but half of it just sounded uninspired like Hans Zimmer and most other hollywood soundtrack composers. I hope this is just a fluke and not the rule to John Williams newer music. BB8: "Lets make a droid thats as lovable as R2" "Lets make him look like a soccer ball." It is cool that he was an actual robot, instead of CGI, but he was only made for 1: nostalgia and 2: to sell toys. 3. ANH plot rip off. Captain Phasma: Most people were expecting a badass Stormtrooper Captain, instead we got a shitty trash compacter joke to cash in on nostalgia. Tie Figher Leash: This is definitely nit picking, but having a leash on the tie fighter instead of a magnetic/mag lock is just... stupid. Aliens: Other than a Sullustan pilot, Chewie ( wookie), Admiral Ackbar (Mon Calamari) and I know there was one more species I can't remember right now, there was nothing but new aliens. I don't have a problem with adding new species in, but come on. Please sprinkle in some species that we love. Add some Twi'leks in, some Bith, Zabrak, Chiss, Grann, Gamorreans, Rodians, etc. Although this is small compared to the plot, this is what I fucking HATED about even the first JJ Trek movie. Other than Vulcans, Romulans, Klingons and a random Orion girl and an Andorian in the background, there was nothing familiar. I felt JJ was trying to make his mark both in Star Trek and Star Wars, simply because he can. Although this would be considered fan appeasement, this would be the good kind! First Order Blaster: These things look like shitty toys The plot: This movie was almost a reboot instead of the sequel that it was supposed to be. We got a bigger and badder death star, but with the same flaws, a desert planet, a yoda character, an emperor character, someone like vader, the rebel alliance/the resistance, tarkin/hux, luke is exiling himself like yoda for no reason. It was ANH 2.0 with some Empire and ROTJ sprinkled in. Telling instead of showing: This was a problem in the prequels (as well as 99% of all modern movies) as well. I'm not sure why film makers in hollywood tell instead of show, because telling a story instead of showing is just fucking lazy. At the end of it all, as a long time fan since I was literally 3 years old and got the trilogy on VHS for my 3rd birthday and have always loved it, I just feel violated almost. I know it's fiction, but just like Star Trek and Stargate, Star Wars has been a huge influence on my life and it just hurts to have something you love so much to be torn apart. I'm sure I'm missing some stuff. If and when I remember it, I'll add it in future posts.

What .... are ... you smoking? :-)The movie was great!!

Well yeah it hit all of the right notes for nostalgia, but the rewritten EU elements were bad. I enjoyed the movie, I'm just sad to see something that i grew up on destroyed.

Admittedly I didn't read all that. I think I can sympathize though. Now, I have to think that for everything in the EU that is universally known and widely loved, there are 2 or 3 things that are probably just terrible. But here is the thing that gets to me, I mean really, really gets to me: everything from EU is now gone, but the FUCKING PREQUELS ARE STILL CANON? What the hell is that? Wouldn't Disney have been able to make boatloads of money by remaking the prequels? I just can't take it. Also, while overall I did like the new movie, it fares far worse when thought of as part of a series, due to the fact that it had exactly the same plot as Episode IV. That really doesn't serve Star Wars as a whole. I think that may be the single worst thing about the new movie.

Everyone knows the EU has a lot of shit sprinkled in with the gems. I'm not caring about that though. Of course the prequels are canon, but I can't stand how pre TPM isn't even canon anymore, it's just silly, especially since TOR still has frequent expansion packs come out from EA. I completely agree with you about the movie. Instead of a sequel (hello episode 7!!) we basically got a reboot in the form of a sequel. Disney is obviously doing everything for profit (duh thats going to happen in anything a corporation touches). But Disney doesn't even respect long time fans with how they treated the EU or even the new movie. Marvel fans love Disney, and for good reason. Disney respected the Marvel universe. It seems that since Star Wars is one of the highest grossing franchises, they just said fuck it, we're going for the pure profit ASAP approach.

Of course the prequels are canonI don't see why we have to take that as a given. It would be extremely profitable for them to re-make them, and it would probably make everyone extremely happy, since whatever would come almost could not possibly be worse than what they were. It certainly doesn't bother me that the motive behind making a movie is to make money, but I think the problem with a company as big (and shady? it has a reputation) as Disney is that they will likely be ultra risk adverse. The result is the complete absence of any sort of novelty whatsoever in the new movies. It's a law of economics I suppose. This is a long bemoaned fact of life in the video game industry. The AAA developers make the same games year after year and the indie developers with nothing to lose are responsible for all forward progress. The thing is, video games are far better suited for iterating on the same idea repeatedly (in my opinion), and games with few original ideas are often great. It doesn't really work for movies though, it's silly to use the same plot over and over and call it a new movie every time. That doesn't stop them from trying of course.

Also, while overall I did like the new movie, it fares far worse when thought of as part of a series, due to the fact that it had exactly the same plot as Episode IV. That really doesn't serve Star Wars as a whole. I think that may be the single worst thing about the new movie. Exactly my opinion.

I liked the movie. But imho it is not a good movie. It is a "Star Wars" movie - in that regard it has a better feeling than the previous ones (Ep. I, II, III) but not really good. Some nice touches but lots of wasted opportunity. My main issue is with the argument. I don't mind the nostalgia play, but there was no need to go overboard in element reuse. It lacks needed context - the movie could have been far better at doing a bridge/explanation to what happened in the 30 years since RotJ. Having Rey as Luke Skywalver (on steroids, but more on that later), Luke Skywalker as Ioda, Han Solo as Obi Wan Kenobi, Leia Organa as Admiral Ackbar, Kylo Ren as Darth Vader and a ridiculously named dude (Snope) as the Emperor is a bit too much. At least Chewbacca was himself. The idea of a giant battlestation with immensely destructive powers is quite novel... Just like a desert planet and a Rebel Alliance, I mean, "Resistance". But besides the overall weak argument (and wtf is everyone so interested in finding Luke in the first place) are the "little" details: Rey. I like the girl, but it reminds me of a certain Robert H Heinlein book, (Number of the Beast) where every char was a wonderperson. Rey is simply too good. Details overly known, and she could/should have escaped Ren through luck and being smart, even on his weakened state;A chubby Stormtrooper with a conscience? I do like the char, but there was something not quite right besides the PC black character. But the char itself is quite good (until he becomes something of a puppy love sidekick)The First Order - lack of details, and what is these space nazis wannabes doing around? (yes, they are probably a splinter of the empire after the battle of yavvin, so they had all those imperial toys). Still to know why Hux (great char) did a "rally the troops speech" to Stormtroopers. For practice?... There was still a lot to like, but quite a wasted opportunity.

Maybe we don't get to see Kylo's babyface next time After all, he got screwed up pretty hard, and I think Snoke is going to give him his #1 wish: to become a biomechanical creature just like Darth Vader was. Also, with the republic now decapitated, the resistance can become a real resistance. I think they took a shortcut in this one, because if the resistance formed from the Republic Armed Forces/navy, it'd been far more logical than to have it be already present. The notion from The First Order that the Resistance is a terrorist/insurgent movement is actually then from that perspective correct. As in, they incite violence in TFO controlled territory, while being protected/supported by the republic. I honestly would like to see something done with this part of perception of things, but I doubt we'll see it coming actually considering the tendency of hollywood movie storywriting to usually be revolting crap.

In my opinion star wars TFA it's a non sense. It's not a continue of the story but only a kind of bad made reboot.They took the original story and remade it as it is...at disney producers smoke very bad drugs. :alcoholic:George Lucas left us on disney hands... :suicide:Hope they will do something better on the next two films but the story seems already written.They will do also a spin off trilogy, pearhaps the story will be more original.

George Lucas left us on disney hands... :suicide:Well, to be fair, George Lucas was the one who gave us the prequels so...

He at least gave us something universally hated which we can all agree on must be shot. I happen to have the fortune to have stumbled upon a game which allows just that 8-)http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=620156888[/url] TFA for the most part is a typical modern day hollywood movie and clearly shows how a once somewhat innovative industry has fallen from grace. *side note*Its ironic that due to lax copyright protection Hollywood gained a dominant position in the media industry, and due to the currently strict copyright regime (which led to US media dominance over Europe) Hollywood is in fact quickly losing ground. Oh the irony.

I loved the prequel films!

So I have sat down and watched the new film, pretty good film but I would agree with CrossDressiNate comments about the film, can't say anything about the EU stuff as I'm not the familiar with it.But as I was watching the film I just could not sake the feeling that I was watching something which had been made by a group ticking off a items on check list. Three hero's............................. check.Three villains.............................checkcomical side kick droid...............checkX Wings/ Tie fighter...................checkNew Deathstar...........................checkCantina scene...........................checkDesert Planet............................checkJedi master...............................checkRebels/Empire..........................check And so on but at the end of the day it's a lot better than the prequels and I look forward to see where they go with this and is it just me or do the StormTroopers look fat in this film and the new order has learned nothing from the Empire as they still using cowboy builder to construct their ultimate weapons.