SpaceSimCentral

Something called Space Pirates From Tomorrow on the xbox live thing for the 360,looks pretty good for £3.00.Looks like some sort of Elite clone,you can find the website here[url]http://www.mstargames.co.uk/[/url]

Not bad at all. 2500hrs of gameplay that is great for the price. Here is more info on the game itself http://www.mstargames.co.uk/MediaAssets/SPFT.pdf

Now this is something Frontier should have done for Elites 25 if they had their act together.Another vid showing some of the gameplay.

This video was a nice to see this game in action and it is a pretty decent clone of Elite's feature set. I agree with the 25th anniversary of Elite should have looked something like this and it probably wouldn't have been that hard to do by dedicating a few developers :)I might have to email Mstar Games and see if they are going to bring this title to the PC or PS3. Would be a shame to only be able to play it on the Xbox.

Darkone wrote:
This video was a nice to see this game in action and it is a pretty decent clone of Elite's feature set. I agree with the 25th anniversary of Elite should have looked something like this and it probably wouldn't have been that hard to do by dedicating a few developers :)I might have to email Mstar Games and see if they are going to bring this title to the PC or PS3. Would be a shame to only be able to play it on the Xbox.
And with a burst of plasma, he appeared :0) Hi guys, I'm the idiot responsible for Space Pirates (well, the code anyway). Thanks for the kind words about the game, it's been one hell of a slog but we're almost at release now! Darkone did indeed pop over to our site, and I'm more than happy to answer any questions anyone has about gameplay, features, future releases and so on. I'll start off by addressing the question about releasing on other formats.We're thinking about pushing a version of Space Pirates out for the PC some time after easter. The big problem with developing games for the PC (especially when you're a guy-in-a-shed operation) is that you have to test with soooooo many different hardware combinations if you're going to charge for it. So what we're thinking is that after we've made reasonable sales of the 360 version we might release it for free on the PC. It actually won't take that much work to ready it for the PC anyway. I haven't really looked in to developing for the PS3, so I don't know the cost of the software development kit. When we're a bit further down the road and we see what sales we get on the 360 we'll have a think about it, but that would take probably a year for us to get used to the tools for PS3 development and we've already got 2 more games in the design/development cycle which are just for the xbox - so it would be maybe 2 years away from release on the PS3 if it happens at all I'm afraid! At the moment we have to focus on the 360 platform because that's where our skills are based. We need to keep producing a game roughly every 5 or 6 months to make enough to carry on going, and I hear through the underground grapevine that you get a pretty poor cut as a developer on PSN.In short then, PC probably, and if so probably free. PS3 very unlikely.Best regards,Mike

Hi DrMistryCongratulation on the game I think you are the first to get a proper 3d space sim onto this gen of consoles.like the ref to commander jameson in the vid. Any chance of seeing some more vids of the combat,trading mining,how the interface works ect?.Do the systems like Elite just contain a planet sun and station or is there more in SPFT?.Do you use fuel to get from one system to another?,and can you sundive at the sun to refuel.Is there a short and long range chart?.Do you just have one ship or can you change ships?.Will there be any mod tools for the pc version?.

Thanks for stopping in and answering community questions DrMistry. It is great to see games like this coming to the console, especially with the depth of Space Pirates. I know QA'ing software for use on various platforms can be a task. But if you are possibly going to release a free version then testing could just be broad. Pinback mentioned modding, if Space Pirates has this then the community will build content and work on any fixes Space Pirates might need. There is a huge fan base for the Elite style games and would really be accepted in any state its in :)But even if you have to purchase Space Pirates for the same price that will be on Xbox Live that will still be a great deal as well. DrMistry if you have a features sheet for Space Pirates I couldn't really find one going through the website. But from the videos looks like you stuck to a lot of the Elite style concepts. Having to make a new game every 5-6 months is a daunting task indeed, hope you sell enough Space Pirates to once per year

Oooh goody I get to go on about all the cool bits of code I've shoehorned in to the game I'll work on a usable and fun document outlining the game and it's features and post here as soon as it's done. Just coming back from a new-year break Thanks for all the interest guys!In answer to the modding question - there's relatively little which can be modded to be honest. The star system names, positions and characteristics are all procedurally generated at runtime, the missions engine takes input from the systems generated to create the missions at runtime, and everything else hangs off of those. I'm not sure if it's possible for us to release the source code because (aside from some control model differences) it'll be exactly the same as the xbox product, but as I said earlier we have all kinds of options once we've met our objectives for sales on the xbox. We're already starting to think about the next Space Pirates game so I'll raise the idea of making SPfT open source when we get closer to starting the code on that one. It's not too complex a program, and at around 30,000 lines of code not unmanagable for experienced programmers familiar with C and the XNA Framework. No promises, but it's an option at least.And also the questions about the menu system. Not too difficult to answer - the following screens and functions are provided by the on-board computer:Status Screen (pilot ranking/cash/location etc), Ship's Log (automated log of game events), Player Stats (kills, missions, races, systems visited etc), Messages (simple email client with catagorised replies available for selected game messages), trading (very elite-esque but I would argue there's no better way to do it), navigation (short and long-range maps available), shipyard (upgrades, weapons and fuel), jobs screen (available missions), roster screen (current enrolled missions), game load/save and options.We've tried to stay true to the classic of the genre because a) real gamers will feel right at home with it, b) it's a very good core feature set and c) there's always a yardstick to see how you're doing in terms of quality and playability. If you're anywhere near at home with Elite, you'll be fine with Space Pirates.I'll be working on more content for our website over the next few days. Annoyingly my vidcap device passed away over Christmas so I'm not sure how long it will be before I can make any more trailers, but there will be lots of stuff coming up in the way of gameplay info, tutorials, screenshots and more general waffle from me.Best regards,Mike

Excellent that you are thinking about a sequal to the game,I suggest adding Frontier planet landings.If nothing else it would feak the console monkeys. Really like the music you used in the vids tried to download the zip file from the site but found it was not working,any chance of reposting it. Will you be able to use the 360 pad on the pc version?

Thanks, yes and yes We were thinking about trading betwen planets as well as between stations, but the planet texture generation code we settled on was waaaay too slow to allow flying that close to the planets while maintaining a reasonable framerate. We'll keep it in mind for the next game.I'll repost the zip file today - I've got to add a couple of new songs, Blue Danube and Per Par Parp Astra Zarazossa or whatever it's called, you know the music from 2001...[edit] The updated soundtrack is now available on the site in the usual place - look under the POPULAR list on the homepage and you'll see it there. Lots more songs in this .zip file than in the old (broken) one![/edit]Regards,Mike

I just realised that I'd got nowhere close to answering Pinback's questions in my previous posts. Poor form on my part, sorry guys!
PINBACK wrote:
Hi DrMistryCongratulation on the game I think you are the first to get a proper 3d space sim onto this gen of consoles.like the ref to commander jameson in the vid. Any chance of seeing some more vids of the combat,trading mining,how the interface works ect?.
Sadly at the moment I'm without a working video capture device, which makes things tough. The LOOOOONG trailer on our YouTube channel shows some more of the user interface at work and if memory serves there's a bit of mining in there too. You basically buy a 4-pack of mining droids at a station, and deploy them in space. They fly to the closest asteroid and start digging, ejecting crates in to free space for you (or any other nearby enemies ) to bag.
PINBACK wrote:
Do the systems like Elite just contain a planet sun and station or is there more in SPFT?.
Yea each system has somewhere between 5 and 12 planets, and some asteroids. They're all individually unique within the game, so you should never see the same planet twice anywhere in the game. There's no interaction with the planets though, but it's always fun to fly around and do some sunrise Hollywood shots
PINBACK wrote:
Do you use fuel to get from one system to another?,and can you sundive at the sun to refuel.
We thought about using sun skimming to refuel your hyperspace tanks, but you get a reasonable amount of cash for blowing those naughty space pirates up. You absolutely need hyperspace fuel to get between systems, but with the average spatial distribution of the systems you can make 2 or more jumps with one tankful most of the time. Some systems are only accessible if you buy the fueltank upgrade.
PINBACK wrote:
Is there a short and long range chart?.
Yea, long and short range are available. You also get maps for missions (both those available to you and those you've accepted) so you can plan your route and trading options while doing other stuff. I can't tell you how much aggro the mission mapping gave us, but we're there now
PINBACK wrote:
Do you just have one ship or can you change ships?.
Just the one ship in this version. That will definitely change in the next installment.
PINBACK wrote:
Will there be any mod tools for the pc version?.
Ah, the one question I did answer! One of the big challenges for us was to create an entirely self-contained game where as much as possible is calculated at run-time in a reliable, well-behaved set of functions because otherwise we would have needed to spend weeks and weeks just thinking up names for the 9,000 star systems!I'll keep you all up-to-date as we (hopefully!) approach release, and I'm really looking forward to some good feedback from same hard-to-please gamers. I'd not expect that we've got everything right, but I think it compares very well to some other indie Elite-a-likes and we're always willing and ready to learn and make better games in the future. Thanks for the comments and interest folks, it's really appreciated when you're stuck in a ferrzing cold cellar with just a smelly cat and cup of coffee for company ;)Regards,Mike

Thanks DrMistry for the answers and I will have anothere go at downloading the file later on got a few other questions that I ment to ask about the game.Is there a docking procedure when you dock with the station.will there be more than one type of station.is there any thing going out side the station,ie ship waiting to dock,taking on cargo,refueling.Will there be any lost ship to find in the game,and loot for treasure.Have you tried washing the cat

No there's no sequence or cutscene or anything like that for docking, and no docking computer. It's just a matter of mashing the Y button when your ship tells you and you dock automatically and instantly. We tried a docking computer early on in the games development and we just weren't happy with it - kept crashing and doing everything other than dock, so we just dropped back to "keep it simple".There's only one space station "model", and this was mainly because some testers got a bit confused when we introduced a new one. Sounds crazy I know, but they were pretty adamant that things were better with one universal space station.All the other ships in the game get on with doing their own thing at all times, if you're docked or not (you can actually hear other ships getting shot at and blown up while you're docked). There're traders docking and undocking, trading, jumping in and out of the system, police chasing pirates, pirates chasing everyone. You can watch the market prices change as other ships dock and trade too.As far as loot goes, you can bag that by blowing up other ships and collecting the surviving cargo, or you can buy a short-range teleport. That lets you grab cargo and passengers from other ships, and even to transfer cargo and crew to another ship. The larger trading ships are positively laden down with cargo and I regularly grab armfulls of the stuff to sell :)We did wash the cat - all it did was shrunk her by about 40%!Regards,Mike

surprising but i think i won't buy a x-box just because of your game, else i would like to porouse it.i understand the problems of releasing it on PC, on the other hand.....(isn't it possible to run it on a virtual machine which fits to most hardware/OS?, gets slow i know)it's fantastic how elite (and clones of) keeps players hanging on to it since 25 years.i loved the concept from the start (like many).sadly they won't release a Elite4 (i think).now it's up to yours (and probably us).just one ship,just one kinda space station,no (manual) landing, docking, hmmm.........things i allways liked much in Frontier i won't miss (try to land on a asteroid, scooping fuel from a stars corona, get experience with sling shot's)it should not only be related to trading and combat, even if a lot of things sounds good like, transfering goods/poeple from/to another ship, yes i allwas wanted that. prices on market relaying to actual solds/buys, pure realism, nice.me (and a lot of us elite/frontier fans) wish to have more things to do than just playing missions in a preassumed way, i dreamed once about a completely free space sim (many years ago), where you can also embark colonist's to settle on a new planet, which maybe becomes your's, where you can effectively play a role in the prospering of a star system or a certain species, my friends in those days declared me as a dreamer (your'e nuts) and such a huge and complex game could never be released neither that it is playable. but i still hang on to that dream. a possibility to compete with other players should be given, but not necessarly (maybe just a score/rank table, or just for fun a p2p dogfight).keep on truckin'

My own, private manifesto for writing games is as follows:The game should provide an environment in which goals are set. How those goals are reached depends only in part on what you give the player - it's what the player DOES with those things that matters. If I give a real person a screwdriver, he can take a door off it's hinges, or fix a toaster, or stir some paint, or stab someone, or scratch his name in to a window. You can do all these things with a really very simple object in the real world, and it' only a handful of physics problems you need to implemet to allow the screwdriver in a game world to do the same types of things. The problem is, how do you a) get a game running at 60 frames a second while juggling the equations you need to pull it off. So what we do is take a step back and say "well, this laser heats things up to the point where they combust, loose cohesion, explode, melt or whatever) which is still complex, but by carefully choosing where and when we think about those physical effects, which usually means limiting the player's actions but can also mean we have a large number of more simple interactions. Say you sacrifice the laser's ability to heat things so that things always blow up for example. That's still pretty tough so unless you have the best part of a research faculty at your disposal you take yet another step back, and say things like"well the user has a teleport. Teleports move things, from one place to another. We're limited to the teleport being used while on a ship because that's where it's fitted, and you can only access the teleport controls when you're in space. So all we have to manage is grabbing and putting cargo and people which really are only notional bits of data." But being able to remove a game character from one ship and put them in YOUR ship, and then yet another ship, is something I've not seen in a freespace trader/combat sim, even though it's just following the logic through to it's conclusion.The idea of a galaxy which is only partially populated is a very interesting one. Early on in the design proces for Space Pirates we thought about giving players the ability to set up production centers (farms, mines, foundries, shipyards and so on) on planets, making a progressive profit as the goods made are sold, provided the market is right. That then opened up the possibility of buying space stations, which also leads to the idea that you can populate a "virgin" system, set up industries, establish a space station and government, and reap the rewards while you defend your system against pirates, or hijack the cargo of frieghters, or whatever. At that point we got a bit scared, put our pens down and backed away from the table slowly! But it is certainly something I would love to think about for the next game. Really when you look at what would really happen, and what you could reasonable expect to be able to do in a "real" environment then pioneering and owning production plants is really scratching the surface, but a full-featured "life" where you can become a real element of the game which other players have to contend with is really just a matter of building lots of simple behaviours and features and stringing them all together. Right now our feature list for the next Space Pirates game looks like about 4 years of work!Boy you've got me thinking now...Regards,Mike

DrMistry wrote:
All the other ships in the game get on with doing their own thing at all times, if you're docked or not (you can actually hear other ships getting shot at and blown up while you're docked). There're traders docking and undocking, trading, jumping in and out of the system, police chasing pirates, pirates chasing everyone. You can watch the market prices change as other ships dock and trade too.
Especially like the last part were docking traders can effect market prices as you dock, nice touch.
DrMistry wrote:
Early on in the design proces for Space Pirates we thought about giving players the ability to set up production centers (farms, mines, foundries, shipyards and so on) on planets, making a progressive profit as the goods made are sold, provided the market is right. That then opened up the possibility of buying space stations, which also leads to the idea that you can populate a "virgin" system, set up industries, establish a space station and government, and reap the rewards while you defend your system against pirates, or hijack the cargo of frieghters, or whatever.
I'm a console gamer and i think you made the right choice. Not to bash myself or other console gamers but I don't think the majority of console gamers would appreciate the complexity, unless it can be streamlined to make it have a more hands off experience. Basically don't have a X3TC type experience. I know at home I watch the kids loose interest in a game in about 1-3wks and it sits. Nevermind if the game is hard to complicated then they say it 'sucks', hehe kids today hate to lose and be challenged.

I think console gamer would be able to handle that as long as there was a really well designed icon interface,the only thing is that sort of feature should only be part of the game and not become the whole game as has happened in the x games.

Any update on a relase date DrMistry?.

The game is at 58% progress through the release testing process. By my reconing, another 3 passes will get the job done. I would expect us to be on the marketplace at any point between tonight and Tuesday. Hopefully all the other XNA developers are snowbound and looking for games to test ;)If anyone's interested in the processes that we have to go through to get a game out and about, have a looksee at http://creators.xna.com - lots of friendly developers working on lots of cool games (and, it has to be said, some lousy ones too!)Not long to lift-off now! Everyone ready with the Blue Danube waltz? Regards,Mike

My dear friends! I bring good news from a distant star! Space Pirates from Tomorrow is now available on Xbox LIVE Marketplace, in the Indie Games channel Thanks so much for all your interest, it made the last weeks before release so much easier to handle knowing that people are looking forward to trying the game. As for all Xbox downloadable games, there's a free demo, and you can always chance your arm on our website and enter out compo for 5 free copies of the game.Thanks again for all the support and interest, and we hope you enjoy the game.Best regards,Mike